Best Version on the Valley

by **Action10** » December 28th, 2021, 2:20 pm

Since every thread about Valley expansion has become a fight over Murray State, I wanted to ask a simple question.
What legitimate membership changes (or simply staying a 10 member league with Belmont replacing Loyola) would be most beneficial for your school? I am hopeful that fighting does not break out, but am interested to hear the viewpoints from the perspective of a fan wanting what is best for their school.
I could be wrong, but I think why is just as interesting as who when the question is framed like this.

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by **BCPanther** » December 28th, 2021, 2:30 pm

For UNI in that way, Kansas City and UIC.

The KC suburbs have become fertile recruiting grounds for both athletes and regular students and Chicago is Chicago. They're also both on the fringe of being bus trips for our athletic teams.

From a purely UNI stance the rank of current candidates would be Kansas City, UIC, Omaha, Arlington, Murray.

by **Adunk33** » December 28th, 2021, 3:02 pm

Other than a couple over zealous posters, it seems collectively Redbird fans would like to go the UIC/Murray State route. I agree with that.

The Missouri Valley has long prided itself on putting competitive basketball on the court, getting multiple teams to the NCAAs and winning games when they get there. I believe I saw a stat a year or two ago that the MVC was near the top winning % in the NCAA tournament over the last 15 or so years. I can't seem to find it now, but it was impressive.

When you look at the teams available, Murray State has had a consistently strong men's basketball team for quite some time. So what team of the ones mentioned would help the conference accomplish the goal of getting to the tournament and winning games? Murray State. They would likely bring another Q2 opportunity into the league.

For UIC, it really comes down to being in Chicago. Of course, they are probably the fourth most desirable Chicago school a recruit would want but I find value in keeping a presence up north. I think being in the MVC would help them recruit better as well. Instead of saying you're getting games against IUPUI and Cleveland State (I know they are doing better this year) you're getting a couple consistent fringe top 25 teams in Drake, Belmont, and potentially Murray State. I've mentioned a couple of times but I think Coach Yak up there is going to do some good things, just needs a little time to put it together. He has decades of ties in the Chicago land area and eventually I think that will bare fruit.

12 teams. Go with the best basketball team available and couple that with the best market available.

I know that so much more than basketball goes into these decisions as presidents have to think about enrollment and getting into bigger markets for exposure but if you're looking at basketball-first I have to go with UIC and Murray State though we're likely getting Arlington and UIC.

by **mvfcfan** » December 28th, 2021, 3:55 pm

Indiana State fan and here's my list in order with reasons.

#1 Murray State
1) They are a school that a rather uninterested Terre Haute would come out and see, particularly if they are in or near the Top 25. Murray State is generally a well attended game for Eastern Illinois who rarely draws over a 1000 people for a game. No one in Terre Haute will care about any of the other choices.
2) They have a football team that would be close for us to travel to, assuming they get in the MVFC. I know most on here don't care about football, but that is a thing that would benefit us.
3) They have a baseball team and ISU's best sport traditionally is baseball.

#2 UIC
1) Only 3 hours north of Terre Haute.
2) They have a decent baseball program which means that they would be more beneficial to us than Loyola was in my view.

#3-5 Others: UNO, UMKC, UTA (in that order)
1) The others don't benefit us much. They just add travel and no one in Terre Haute would care about any of those schools and I doubt most people in TH have ever even heard of those schools.
2) UNO is ahead of UMKC because they have baseball in the town where the CWS is located. UMKC is ahead of UTA because of location.

by **Bulldog2323** » December 28th, 2021, 7:35 pm

I'm speaking for Drake, but I suspect I'm going to be in the minority here.

We specifically don't have much to gain or lose from staying at 10 or expanding otherwise.

Given Des Moines' central location, we have no problem getting students from Illinois (including Chicago), Minnesota, Missouri, Kansas, even South Dakota & Nebraska. There are regularly (or there were pre-pandemic) bus trips from Chicago & Kansas City among others to Drake for campus visits.

Could a Murray State or UTA help in those areas? Sure. That said, Drake also has data from the Pioneer Football League's nationwide presence to draw upon to see if it truly makes a difference when voting. Granted, PFL football vs. MVC basketball is different in many ways but it's a metric none-the-less. We've also proven to the chagrin of critics that we don't care about travel costs with our PFL participation.

Personally, I like staying at 10. The round-robin works and I hate divisions.

If you want to talk basketball benefits, those would be for the conference as a whole and match what others have already said.

by **tribecalledquest** » December 29th, 2021, 3:37 pm

Bulldog2323 wrote:I'm speaking for Drake, but I suspect I'm going to be in the minority here.

We specifically don't have much to gain or lose from staying at 10 or expanding otherwise.

Given Des Moines' central location, we have no problem getting students from Illinois (including Chicago), Minnesota, Missouri, Kansas, even South Dakota & Nebraska. There are regularly (or there were pre-pandemic) bus trips from Chicago & Kansas City among others to Drake for campus visits.

Could a Murray State or UTA help in those areas? Sure. That said, Drake also has data from the Pioneer Football League's nationwide presence to draw upon to see if it truly makes a difference when voting. Granted, PFL football vs. MVC basketball is different in many ways but it's a metric none-the-less. We've also proven to the chagrin of critics that we don't care about travel costs with our PFL participation.

Personally, I like staying at 10. The round-robin works and I hate divisions.

If you want to talk basketball benefits, those would be for the conference as a whole and match what others have already said.

I'm kind of here too. Keeping these 10 is fine with me.

by **DUBulldog** » December 29th, 2021, 4:11 pm

Action10 wrote:Since every thread about Valley expansion has become a fight over Murray State, I wanted to ask a simple question.
What legitimate membership changes (or simply staying a 10 member league with Belmont replacing Loyola) would be most beneficial for your school? I am hopeful that fighting does not break out, but am interested to hear the viewpoints from the perspective of a fan wanting what is best for their school.
I could be wrong, but I think why is just as interesting as who when the question is framed like this.

I honestly don't know what additions would be best for my school.

From a purely basketball standpoint, Murray State is the school that makes the most sense.

by **letsgoAces** » January 2nd, 2022, 8:23 am

Honestly, as an Aces fan, I have generally viewed expansion in terms of how I feel it would benefit the entire league. No one is going to move the basketball needle more than Murray State....no one. The Racers give the MVC a much better chance to become a 2 bid league than anyone else, not even close. Their style of play and great fans I think would energize and impact our league far beyond what any other school could. Yes, as an Evansville fan, Murray Kentucky is close by and we have enjoyed a great rivalry....we like playing them. So will everyone else. Wouldn't it be nice to see Racer fans bring out 5 thousand or more fans out to Arch Madness!!!

Next in line is UIC. The MVC needs that presence in Chicago for reasons we all should understand by now. For some reason, I think the Flames could end up being a lot more competitive than what they have showed in recent years.

The only school I have little interest in is KC. IMO, most Evansville fans do not understand "market", and would see the addition of this school as totally insane. For myself, I cannot even begin to say what a bad choice they would be. It seems that in the Roos case, it is like the league is trying to put a circle in a square hole. This school is a ghost in their own town...literally. Their presence would do nothing for the league. Low marks in terms of facilities, fan interests, investment. Knowledgeable fans love the potential market they bring, but you have to bring at least something else to the table. Besides other candidates who are being considered by the MVC, I would add NKU, Milwaukee, Little Rock, or Wright State long before I would ever admit KC

by **BearsCountry** » January 3rd, 2022, 1:01 pm

The Valley footprint from 1990 to 1994 from a Missouri State perspective.

by **tdawgs87** » January 3rd, 2022, 3:20 pm

For a SIU fan I say adding UIC and Murray St. Talking with SIU and I believe that Ben Jacobson mentioned this in an interview last month it is becoming harder and harder to try and schedule non-conference games. I am not talking about power 5 games we all know that issue I am talking about just quality non-conference games. So by adding two more quality programs to get us to 12 (already counted Belmont) this will help with scheduling. With saying that my fear is that we add a boat anchor or two and that will make the problem worse. Right now SIU is closer to the boat anchoring stage than a quality opponent.