SIU, CU, UNI to new conference? SI.com

[MoValley John]

[quote="AndShock"]This guy presents a good idea but I don't think he actually has any idea what he's talking about. He just picked out a bunch of name schools and said they should make a conference. There are more important factors than median RPI.[/quote]

I think he tried to use some geography as well. I think Wichita State was left out simply because they were too far west and south for the footprint. Creighton really isn't in the footprint either, but they fit with Northern Iowa.

The whole concept is awesome, and I think something like this will happen sooner rather than later, but the conference is spread too far already and there are some question marks regarding teams included. I have to give him credit for a rough draft, however.

Try this one. It's poorly thought out, but top of mind some interesting teams and would be a huge media footprint.
West
Creighton
Wichita State
Tulsa
Saint Louis
Butler
Dayton- Xavier

East
George Mason
VCU
Memphis
Dayton- Xavier
UMass
Temple

[MoValley John]

[quote="unipanther99"]Conferences with good programs need some average programs as well, otherwise all the good programs do is beat each other up. Its easy for an outsider to look at these schools and say, wow-- great conference. But as I look at it, I'm thinking... yikes-- brutal schedule. Good programs want to be able to look at their conference schedule and say at least a third or half of their games "should be wins." That's not to say they all will be. But this just looks like murderers row to me.[/quote]

Yep. Coaches would hate it, but fans would absolutely LOVE IT! Like the Valley has coaching turnover, this league would have coaching turnover, but for a completely different reason.

[valleychamp]

Conferences with good programs need some average programs as well, otherwise all the good programs do is beat each other up. Its easy for an outsider to look at these schools and say, wow-- great conference. But as I look at it, I'm thinking... yikes-- brutal schedule. Good programs want to be able to look at their conference schedule and say at least a third or half of their games "should be wins." That's not to say they all will be. But this just looks like murderers row to me.

You gotta realize that it would not be considered a "mid-major" conference. If you finished in the top half of that conference, there is a good chance you'd be in the tournament. You wouldn't have to finish top 2 to even be in the mix like you would in most mid-major leagues in most years.

[Shox21]

Conferences with good programs need some average programs as well, otherwise all the good programs do is beat each other up. Its easy for an outsider to look at these schools and say, wow-- great conference. But as I look at it, I'm thinking... yikes-- brutal schedule. Good programs want to be able to look at their conference schedule and say at least a third or half of their games "should be wins." That's not to say they all will be. But this just looks like murderers row to me.

But isn't that exactly what happened in 2006 when the Valley got 4 teams in the Dance? Most of the Valley schools had decent out of conference games (with an appropriate number being won) which raised the Valley RPI and then we started beating up on each other in conference. Worked that year.

[jayball]

We all want a stronger conference and better chance of making the NCAAs but I agree with 99. Unless you are getting 3+ bids what is the point? Would that conference be able to generate 3 bids off the bat? Not sure about that. I think we would potentially still be considered midmajor. Additionally, i don't think his list of schools is realistic.

1.) What incentive would the a-10 schools have to leave?

They seem to have a good balance of stable strong programs, mediocre programs that can have good years, and weaker programs to pad W-L record of upper tier teams. Plus they have a higher profile with East Coast media, more concentrated populations centers nearby to recruit from....ect. Why would any of those schools leave? I don't see what they get out of this arrangement.

2.) How do you pick the "major" midmajors that can and will maintain their "major" status. Many would argue the SIU is in a potnetial death spiral and will be challenged to pay a good coach enough to stay past rebuilding post-Lowery. Same could be said for UNI if Jake leaves. The success at either school has been pretty astonishing considering the resources available, I just don't know how you can predict how long the upswing can be maintained. Schools like CU and WSU have a bit more resources to work with, but no guarantees either. Cu would not have been anywhere close to these conversations in 1995. It takes one wrong hire or a few recruiting misses and things can get tough quick. How long will George Mason stay relevant without Larranaga or VCU without Smart? I have no idea what the resources they are working with. Plus someone is going to start finishing last in this new conference instead of finishing first in their old confernce. That will get old for a fanbase pretty quick.

3.) TV money and scheduling. Would this conference get more nationally televised games? Would conference members be able to schedule the big boys more frequently? Would George Mason v Butler really grab national interest every year? Not sure the Cinderella effect of March would carryover during conference play. We would still have to schedule and beat the "big" boys to get respect.

[WSUbballer]

Simply complying a conference based on average RPI over a period is pretty funny stuff. There are A LOT more factors involved and thus I'm hoping the author was only being half-hearted with it.

SIU being mentioned really was the topper for me.

[Ace Dad]

The article uses poor logic: Creating another conference of NCAA tournament competitive programs may mean that the lower two thirds of the newer conference do not get in because they do not show as well in the new conference.

This is a zero sum game. There are 68 bids. A good team in an average conference has a better shot at the tournament then a good team in a good conference. The trick is to schedule OOC games with competitive teams and WIN.

Another flaw is the Horizon League did prepare Butler University for the NCAAs. So did the Evansville game.

The CAA prepared VCU for the NCAAs. So did the WSU game.

ESPN keeps talking this bullchit about Big East teams beating up on each other. Guess what? MVC teams beat up on each other. CAA teams beat up on each other. A heavy weight beating the xhit out of a heavy weight is the same as a middle weight beating the xhit out of a middle weight.

Sometimes it is better to be "King" of a small Kingdom than to be the "Prince" of a large Kingdom. Leaving your castle to go to a faraway land to rebuild a newer, bigger castle, entails risks. But, since money is the driving factor, do whatever results in mo' money.

[valleychamp]

Simply complying a conference based on average RPI over a period is pretty funny stuff. There are A LOT more factors involved and thus I'm hoping the author was only being half-hearted with it.

SIU being mentioned really was the topper for me.

He did not "simply comply a conference based on RPI".

The Major League would consist solely of programs that have demonstrated the ability to contend regularly for NCAA tournament berths, and advance once they get there; committed a certain threshold of financial resources to their program; and boast a comparable-sized fan base to the average power-conference team.

[WSUbballer]

I don't think all of the teams listed fulfill all of those terms.

And besides, SIU has now demonstrated that they won't be sniffing an NCAA bid for at least a 10 year stretch. Who knows how long the ride with UNI will last?

I'll use UNI for a quick example. UNI has done similar things to what WSU did in the 1980's (WSU went a bit further with an Elite 8 appearance). Should WSU have been considered for another conference based on their run?

Either way, it's very unrealistic and very silly. Yeah, let's just grab all of the "hot" teams together and put em in a conference and see how it goes (even though a few of the teams aren't hot).

[MoValley John]

A couple of things, AceDad, you are right, money is the driving factor. Money is always the driving factor. UNI dropped baseball, not because of Title IX, but because of money. Nebraska and Colorado left the Big XII not because of geographical fits or hatred of Texas, but because of money. Coaches jump from successful midmajor programs to troubled major programs because of money.

That said, one of the biggest problems with the Valley is the money. Money, money, money. The Valley wants multiple bids because multiple bids bring in more money. Individual teams that try and get snubbed by the selection committee, not only get snubbed for their efforts, but they lose money. The article was pretty clear in the objective, if you combined these schools it would generate tons of money. The Valley doesn't generate tons of money. There are a few teams that spend a lot of money and bring in a lot of revenue, but when there is an inbalance between schools on how they fund their programs and how much money certain schools bring back into the Valley, there will always be tension. The leading causes of divorce in America is money. The leading cause of business partnerships dissolving is money. Lastly, you can't go to Disneyland if you got no money. Money, money, money. Money does not come in droves when you have teams playing in half full arenas and only a few games are covered on ESPN22 and the rest on the St Louis Fox affiliate.

That said, any new conference would be put together with schools willing to commit and spend a more equitable amount of money. Teams may struggle and budgets at some schools grow larger or smaller, but they will all be larger than what they are now. The increased exposure is a nice caveat, it helps with recruiting, but in the end, more exposue equates more money. At the end of the day, the competition level would be greater and yes, it would be a dogfight if you had heavyweights beating up on each other every night. 11-7 might even win the league. But at the end of the day, fans would flock to watch the Friday Night Fights, the battles would be on national television and even the "bad" teams would be getting more exposure than they can get today and they would be cashing larger checks. It's all about the money. Money, money, money.