MVC 10 Members or 12? Front-runners?

[isumvc1]

Elgin was just on Bluejay banter, they only talked about the MVC season and Arch Madness. No mention of conference shuffling.

Regardless, sounds like Arch Madness is gonna be very cool, have fun all those going!

[Jet915]

Elgin was just on Bluejay banter, they only talked about the MVC season and Arch Madness. No mention of conference shuffling.

Regardless, sounds like Arch Madness is gonna be very cool, have fun all those going!

Bluejay Banter guys said specifically that they were not allowed to ask Elgin about ANYTHING related to conference realignment...

[isumvc1]

Elgin was just on Bluejay banter, they only talked about the MVC season and Arch Madness. No mention of conference shuffling.

Regardless, sounds like Arch Madness is gonna be very cool, have fun all those going!

Bluejay Banter guys said specifically that they were not allowed to ask Elgin about ANYTHING related to conference realignment...

yeah, I heard that at the top of the show. Sure wish they'd hurry up and announce all this rearrangement so we'll know what's going on.

[Jet915]

Instead of looking north like NDSU, I would think the Valley would want to add nice academic schools who are committed to basketball and are in a nice market. IMO, that would mean University of Denver out west, Belmont (Nashville) to the east and Oral Roberts (Tulsa) to the south. Those are the most viable options I would think.

[flybird1]

Basically, your best option is to try and lure Dayton/SLU if either of those schools aren't taken by the C7. SLU is unlikely, because of their eastern affiliations, but I think we can convince Dayton to join if they had no similar partners in the A10. That would be a net downgrade in terms of basketball, but almost certainly an upgrade in terms of support (Dayton has HUGE revenues, something like $10,000,000 a year).

Once those options are extinguished, look to expand to 10 immediately with Valparaiso, XDSU's, etc. If Illinois State, UNI, Wichita State, or Evansville start to try and leave, you have to build the league up to 12 teams preemptively.

I agree with this option, I see the benefits of staying at 10 versus 12. But both options need to be studied carefully, I just don't think we should stay at nine, The Valley would look to weak and passive. We strike for 10 minimum. If Dayton is left out, I agree we should sell the league and take them. Some have said we need to take a private like ORU, I'd rather much take a Dayton than an ORU. But if we are looking for just a 10th member we should make that clear. However if Dayton does talk its way into the C-7, we should take one hard look at Akron, like one of the other posters have mentioned.

[TheAsianSensation]

Consider this sort of a complete assembly of random ideas, in generic order of preference. I hope this is an exhaustive look at every possible angle.

1) Pry St Louis and/or Dayton from the A-10. Obviously this depends on what the C7 eventually does. Hopefully this is obvious as to why it's #1.

2) Add Oral Bob. They're not the sexy pick. But a decent market, private, possible local rival for Wichita, steady program. Metaphorically speaking, don't go looking to add a Kate Upton when you have a few Heidi Klums or Miranda Kerrs to choose from.

3) Add Denver. Bigger market, a bit out there geographically and they do bounce around between conference a lot. There's some good building blocks there though.
3a) if you're worried about geography so much, you can add New Mexico St (indy in FB) as a local rival for them, but then you kind of commit yourself to 12 teams.

4) Add Detroit. A bit of an outlier, this time to the east. But again, a program that can build something in the MVC.

5) Add Belmont. I'm still skeptical, but the basketball product value is obvious. The key to Belmont is that they can work as a standalone invite, while Denver and Detroit may need to be packaged with others. So if you want 10 teams, this is reasonable.

6) Add a Horizon school. Valparaiso, Milwaukee, Wright St, Loyola-Chicago, and even Cleveland St. Each have their own warts (gym size at Valpo, budget concerns at Milwaukee, location for the Ohio schools). I'm slowly leaning towards Belmont over these groups of schools.

7) Add Murray St. If you're going to go with small basketball power, go Belmont istead.

The longshot opportunities:

8) South Dakota St. If we have to add a Dakota, this would be the one.

9) Southern expansion pack: up to 3 of Arkansas-Little Rock, Texas-Arlington, New Mexico St, Oral Roberts, Denver. Expands geographic footprint to maybe protect against future poaching, but now you're adding schools with risk bigtime. Unlikely but the schools are available, and if the right TV partner comes along...

10) MAC expansion pack: I mentioned this earlier: get the MAC East teams to go football-only in that conference and to move the rest here, where they can actually compete for at-large bids. Akron, Kent, Ohio, and/or Miami(OH). These schools have to be frustrated they can get at-large bids in that conference. Lean on that.

11) North Dakota St. Definitely inferior to SDSU in terms of MVC desirability. If SDSU wants NDSU as a package deal, then the deal is off.

12) Oakland. Not while Detroit is on the table, IMO.

13) If you do want to integrate MVCF into all this, Youngstown St, Western Illinois, and the XDSUs (and even the regular Dakotas) come into play. I don't see us sacrificing basketball value for this, but you never know if the conference mission will change.

14) Keep an eye on Bellarmine in DII.

15) Nebraska-Omaha and UMKC are terrible ideas, all they have is market, which shouldn't matter unless TV networks start meddling.

16) Some form of A-10 merger where MVC 9 or 10 schools merge with 9 or 10 schools from the A-10. Improbable but not impossible. Strength in numbers?

[BradleyBrave]

Bellarmine will not be any part of any MVC expansion anytime soon. It's absurd to even suggest them right now.

[isumvc1]

Consider this sort of a complete assembly of random ideas, in generic order of preference. I hope this is an exhaustive look at every possible angle.

1) Pry St Louis and/or Dayton from the A-10. Obviously this depends on what the C7 eventually does. Hopefully this is obvious as to why it's #1.

2) Add Oral Bob. They're not the sexy pick. But a decent market, private, possible local rival for Wichita, steady program. Metaphorically speaking, don't go looking to add a Kate Upton when you have a few Heidi Klums or Miranda Kerrs to choose from.

3) Add Denver. Bigger market, a bit out there geographically and they do bounce around between conference a lot. There's some good building blocks there though.
3a) if you're worried about geography so much, you can add New Mexico St (indy in FB) as a local rival for them, but then you kind of commit yourself to 12 teams.

4) Add Detroit. A bit of an outlier, this time to the east. But again, a program that can build something in the MVC.

5) Add Belmont. I'm still skeptical, but the basketball product value is obvious. The key to Belmont is that they can work as a standalone invite, while Denver and Detroit may need to be packaged with others. So if you want 10 teams, this is reasonable.

6) Add a Horizon school. Valparaiso, Milwaukee, Wright St, Loyola-Chicago, and even Cleveland St. Each have their own warts (gym size at Valpo, budget concerns at Milwaukee, location for the Ohio schools). I'm slowly leaning towards Belmont over these groups of schools.

7) Add Murray St. If you're going to go with small basketball power, go Belmont istead.

The longshot opportunities:

8) South Dakota St. If we have to add a Dakota, this would be the one.

9) Southern expansion pack: up to 3 of Arkansas-Little Rock, Texas-Arlington, New Mexico St, Oral Roberts, Denver. Expands geographic footprint to maybe protect against future poaching, but now you're adding schools with risk bigtime. Unlikely but the schools are available, and if the right TV partner comes along...

10) MAC expansion pack: I mentioned this earlier: get the MAC East teams to go football-only in that conference and to move the rest here, where they can actually compete for at-large bids. Akron, Kent, Ohio, and/or Miami(OH). These schools have to be frustrated they can get at-large bids in that conference. Lean on that.

11) North Dakota St. Definitely inferior to SDSU in terms of MVC desirability. If SDSU wants NDSU as a package deal, then the deal is off.

12) Oakland. Not while Detroit is on the table, IMO.

13) If you do want to integrate MVCF into all this, Youngstown St, Western Illinois, and the XDSUs (and even the regular Dakotas) come into play. I don't see us sacrificing basketball value for this, but you never know if the conference mission will change.

14) Keep an eye on Bellarmine in DII.

15) Nebraska-Omaha and UMKC are terrible ideas, all they have is market, which shouldn't matter unless TV networks start meddling.

16) Some form of A-10 merger where MVC 9 or 10 schools merge with 9 or 10 schools from the A-10. Improbable but not impossible. Strength in numbers?

some thoughts, I agree that either Dayton/St.Louis (IF LEFT OUT of C-7) should be the top priority.
Denver - went to look at what sports they offer, they do not offer baseball, softball, cross country or track and field, therefore they may need to add sports.
Oral Roberts - I think they are on top of the list (IF we only add one school). They fit geographically and are a private school. Hope they have their finances in order.
Horizon schools are a possibility, think Valpo is the top choice, or a Chicago school.
MAC schools - just not sure if they'd do this. But intriguing none the less.
NO WAY, NO HOW are the dakota territorial schools being admitted, the MVC presidents are not stupid enough to vote to admit schools that will ADD hundreds of thousands of dollars (or more) to their sports travel budgets every year. And the remaining privates (UE, BU, DU) will all vote a resounding "no".

[SDSUFan]

I know I'm going to get blasted but here is my take on why you should look at SDSU and NDSU. First I want to start with,.....Why is everone bashing Doug Elgin? From my perspective he has brought your conference a ton of stability. If the MVC is a desirable mid-major conference, don't you have to give Elgin some of that credit?

If Dayton and St. Louis don't end up in the Big East, why do you guys want them so bad? You know as well as I do that they are in the next wave or are waiting for an offer from a sexier conference. They would be 2 year rentals most likely, is that what you are really looking for?

There has been mention of a lot of the big market teams like UW-Milwaukee, Detroit, UIC etc but those teams are afterthoughts in those cities. It's not like Omaha and Wichita where they get all of the press and the love. I also don't see an influx of recruits to the rest of the schools just because a metro team joined the conference.

As for some of the other teams like the Belmonts, Murrays etc I think you are always at risk when you take a team that is an outlier school. There will always be a desire for them to get back closer to their region and they would be a potential flight risk every time expansion or realignment is discussed.

With SDSU and NDSU you would have two regional schools that you are already familiar with. We already come with the sports your conference offers and don't have to add. You also have two schools that won't be joining the conference looking for the next best offer to come along. I've spent some time reading the message boards from the other schools. It's pretty apparent that none of you are comfortable with instability. Almost every single board has a faction that wants to upgrade conferences, go FBS football whatever the case maybe. So my question is why wouldn't you want the stability our 2 schools can offer?

I know that moving to your conference wouldn't be easy. But our 2 schools have always strived for excellance. You can check our history in D2 and look at how we have done since joining D1. We will be down initially, but we won't settle with that. The same way you banged on UNI when they joined the conference, they have more than made themselves respectable because they have a passion to be better. Look across the nation and even across your own conference. Some people are just comfortable with being average. Our schools don't represent the town we are in, they represent the entire state, that is what makes us unique despite the smaller communities we are in and helps drive our passion for success.

I know the travel may be expensive, but hopefully the competition will make up for it. Look at the football conference.....Did anyone believe we would be able to come in and compete? Like I said, we may struggle initially but we will get there.

Whether the opportunity arises and whether we get in our not best of luck to your conference, I hope for your sake Creighton stays put and your conference thrives.

[musiccitybulldog]

Bellarmine is tough... Didn't Belmont just change conferences?