Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby Sharpe » December 23rd, 2013, 7:32 pm

rlh04d wrote:
agrinut wrote:[

Good to hear someone stepping up in the front court. That is the key yo the valley receiving multiple tourney units again IMO.

Nothing WSU does is important for the Valley receiving multiple bids except losing to other Valley teams, particularly in St. Louis.

WSU getting better will only hurt the Valley having multiple bids. WSU will make the tournament regardless.


He's talking about $ from the tournament and how a conference gets a certain number of units for each game it plays in March, he's saying WSU looking good = more money for everyone.
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby jackwagon » December 23rd, 2013, 7:46 pm

rlh04d wrote:
jackwagon wrote:. I want to see them beat a legit top 20 team before I join the people dreaming of a return trip to the FF.

Sure. Which Valley team will step up to be a legit top 20 team so we can see that matchup?

As long as all you want is something that can't happen, sure.



That is half the valley's fault and half WSU. Cant tell me WSU couldn't schedule a single top 20 game in the non conference. Marshall's I wont do a non conference game without a home and home is admirable but the problem is top notch programs will not go for that. Sometimes you have to suck it up and take a one and done on the road. Especially if you really think your team is that good.
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby AndShock » December 23rd, 2013, 7:48 pm

jackwagon wrote:
rlh04d wrote:
jackwagon wrote:. I want to see them beat a legit top 20 team before I join the people dreaming of a return trip to the FF.

Sure. Which Valley team will step up to be a legit top 20 team so we can see that matchup?

As long as all you want is something that can't happen, sure.



That is half the valley's fault and half WSU. Cant tell me WSU couldn't schedule a single top 20 game in the non conference. Marshall's I wont do a non conference game without a home and home is admirable but the problem is top notch programs will not go for that. Sometimes you have to suck it up and take a one and done on the road. Especially if you really think your team is that good.


Which Top 20 teams do you think would offer Wichita State a check? Hint: none
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby jackwagon » December 23rd, 2013, 7:52 pm

Wufan wrote:
jackwagon wrote:Didn't mean the post as a slight toward WSU but rather as potential reasons for future concern. The team is 12-0 so they are doing a lot of things right but they are far from bullet proof. I want to see them beat a legit top 20 team before I join the people dreaming of a return trip to the FF. The core 4 guys are good enough but I don't see the depth and frontcourt play needed to get back there. That's all I was saying.

Given the weakness of the valley I could see a 16-2 type valley year. Sucks we wont get to see them play a top 20 team until march madness. Carter and Lufile have to continue to progress if WSU is to compete with the big boys.


I take no offense to this and I doubt many are silly enough to believe we are FF destined (dreaming, yes). However, when comparing last years team to this, Early is playing at a slightly higher level this year than last. Carter is at a similar level to Hall, and Lufile is similar to EO. Coleby is doing what Jake White did. I think you will be impressed with Carter when you see him in league play.

What we are missing is a back up PG like FVV. If we make it to March healthy, we will be okay. We may lose early, but I will take my chances.


Agree with everything you say except that Carter is similar to Hall. He COULD be but 5 solid games does not prove anything. Saying that would be an insult to Hall. Hall was a monster on the interior. Had heart and toughness that could not be matched. Carter will have to get a lot better and stay consistent to meet those lofty achievements. I do think Early and Baker being a year older give this team a boost over last years but there are some weaknesses in this team that need to get resolved by march if they want to get back to the FF.
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby ptownbraves » December 23rd, 2013, 7:53 pm

rlh04d wrote:WSU will make the tournament regardless.


How many conference losses would it take for WSU to miss an at-large bid at this point? (Assuming they don't win in STL)
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby jackwagon » December 23rd, 2013, 8:00 pm

As long as all you want is something that can't happen, sure.[/quote]


That is half the valley's fault and half WSU. Cant tell me WSU couldn't schedule a single top 20 game in the non conference. Marshall's I wont do a non conference game without a home and home is admirable but the problem is top notch programs will not go for that. Sometimes you have to suck it up and take a one and done on the road. Especially if you really think your team is that good.[/quote]

Which Top 20 teams do you think would offer Wichita State a check? Hint: none[/quote]


If WSU is that good why do they need a check to play @ a top notch program? Think a signature win would be enough to consider going on the road without a check.

I understand WSU mentality of not going on the road without a home and home... I really do. FF team who is trying to elevate their standing in college basketball. Just hard to say this season that well we tried to beef up the schedule but nobody would play us card when you aren't open to any one time road games. Don't try to tell me that they couldn't get a top 20 team on this schedule if they didn't want to. Just might not be played where they want it to be.
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby Snaggletooth » December 23rd, 2013, 8:02 pm

ptownbraves wrote:
rlh04d wrote:WSU will make the tournament regardless.


How many conference losses would it take for WSU to miss an at-large bid at this point? (Assuming they don't win in STL)


Enough losses that it finishes 2nd in the MVC
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby Wufan » December 23rd, 2013, 8:26 pm

jackwagon wrote:
Wufan wrote:However, when comparing last years team to this, Early is playing at a slightly higher level this year than last. Carter is at a similar level to Hall, and Lufile is similar to EO. Coleby is doing what Jake White did. I think you will be impressed with Carter when you see him in league play.

What we are missing is a back up PG like FVV. If we make it to March healthy, we will be okay. We may lose early, but I will take my chances.


Agree with everything you say except that Carter is similar to Hall. He COULD be but 5 solid games does not prove anything. Saying that would be an insult to Hall. Hall was a monster on the interior. Had heart and toughness that could not be matched. Carter will have to get a lot better and stay consistent to meet those lofty achievements. I do think Early and Baker being a year older give this team a boost over last years but there are some weaknesses in this team that need to get resolved by march if they want to get back to the FF.


It's no insult to the Beast to say that Carter is playing similarly. There are certainly intangibles that Hall brought to the table that Carter does not. Carter brings a few that Hall missed as well (athleticism), but beyond that they are similarly sized players that play a similar game (inside of 12 foot) and put up similar stats. We road Carl Hall (with the help from some team mates) to a final four last year. Will Carter be THAT good? Probably not. Will he be the best post in the MVC this year? I don't know, but he's starting to "get it" and if WSU flames out early in March, it won't be because of a lack of production from Carter.
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby Shockerfan13 » December 23rd, 2013, 8:41 pm

Tennessee was a border line top 25 team entering the season. Alabama looked like they could have been ok when the game was scheduled.

Point is sometimes the teams you schedule don't perform as expected. Unfortunately a couple of teams we were hoping to help aren't helping so much right now. Can't fault coach for not being able to predict the future.
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Re: Ho Hum - Shox Win Another - Now 12-0

Postby Shockerfan13 » December 23rd, 2013, 8:46 pm

Also Carter is on a similar learning curve that Hall and many very good JUCOS have been on. About the time conference rolls around a light turns on. Carter will be a beast in his own right. Ceiling is higher for him than Hall IMHO. Carter is a deadlier weapon. Just have to wait and see if it comes to be. But I see a lot of similarities in the learning curve between Hall and Carter right now
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