Another Expansion/Realignment Thread

[VUGrad1314]

There are no obvious immediate adds at this time. This isn't like we have a Murray State sitting out there right in our footprint winning tournament games and kicking butt. None of these programs are at that level even though there are some solid choices out there that WOULD make our conference deeper and better. Considering only sports, SDSU and ORU are solid adds but there are travel and institutional issues respectively. St Thomas is too new and unproven though they look like an excellent potential choice. NDSU needs to become less football centric to even enter the conversation. NKU has been evaluated I believe multiple times and has been consistently unable to make the commitments necessary there are also the same out of footprint issues that SDSU presents albeit with easier access because it's easier to fly into Cincinnati. That said, nothing is going to happen (nor should it happen) until we see what happens with the PAC 12 shell and what (if anything) other leagues (namely the Big East which has been quiet as the Big 10 SEC and Big XII have strengthened themselves greatly in basketball) do in response. I'm still pro expansion but we have to be smart about it and only take programs that can for sure help us fight for at large bids. Really only SDSU and ORU even have that potential and they are tough sells for the reasons I have outlined to say nothing of whether they (especially SDSU) can handle the bump up in competition.

Looking at every potential add (not Dayton Not SLU Not Wichita because none of them are coming) It's two tiers Tier 1 is ORU SDSU St Thomas and NDSU Tier 2 is NKU Wright State Bellarmine and Milwaukee and all of them are at best long shots for an actual invitation.

ORU: Checks almost every box but won't happen for institutional reasons
South Dakota State: Excellent all sports choice but far away and offers no recruiting advantage
St Thomas: loads of potential Too new and unproven Worth watching though
North Dakota State: Too football centric Far away No recruiting advantage

NKU: Has been evaluated before questions about ability to financially commit far away Performance not quite at MVC level
Bellarmine: Too new and unproven in D1 Small budget (even though it is growing) is a likely concern
Wright State: Recent budget issues far away from footprint declining enrollment Would love them as a candidate if they were able to right the ship
Milwaukee: Budget issues bad basketball lately Has been previously evaluated and unable to commit to MVC level.

[MissouriValleyUnite]

Nice to see VUGRAD back!

Realistically, any Dakota school isn't in Tier 1 and, truthfully, not in the discussion at the presidential level. Has nothing to do with basketball and everything to do with the off-court drivers of expansion that presidents place emphasis on. There are two enrollment cliffs of historic proportions coming soon. The vast majority of directionals and small privates have already been hit hard and it's only been the tip of the iceberg. Far below the Valley, we've already seen 3 IL schools close in the last 3 years while Birmingham-Southern in AL (former D1 school only 15 years ago) looks to be meeting its death imminently. Any expansion is going to be through these lens. Even if enrollment declines don't result in the extreme outcome of closures, they're still a massive hit to a school's most reliable revenue source.

The next time there's an opening, a mid-sized market will be the bare minimum for presidents for the sake of student recruitment in the war for prospective students. Any out-of-footprint school not in a decent-sized market is a non-starter to the people with the votes.

[TBS_20]

The XDSU's might not even be in play. If the Pac-12 remains I fully expect them both to go to the new Mountain West.

[bluebird0306]

No one else but GCU. Top 100ish every year with Bryce, great commitment to basketball and one of the best markets for university presidents. Get over the fact that its for-profit and add them before they get plucked by the WCC

[BCPanther]

The XDSU's might not even be in play. If the Pac-12 remains I fully expect them both to go to the new Mountain West.

Nah. The Mountain West isn't adding that to their travel budgets to go into no population areas. They're stuck exactly where they're at unless they try a new league with the Montanas and other Big Skys which doesn't make any more sense than the Summit/Valley split

[Chuck A]

We can, and definitely will go back and forth on this issue until the Valley actually goes to 14 or 16! Also, whether some of us like it or not, the previous block of candidates will also be potential invitees the next time around. That group will still include Texas-Arlington, Kansas City, NKU and Oral Roberts with the two new D1 provisional additions of Bellarmine and St. Thomas.

I’ve read the posts and stories about ORU and their issues that might be a concern for the Valley. They do, however, have a quality baseball program and up-and-coming basketball program. Arlington and Kansas City are still areas where there is population growth for the regular student as well as geographic partner possibilities for Missouri State. Kansas City also has plans of building a nice hoops arena on campus. St. Thomas, for that same geographic reason comes into play for the Iowa schools as well as the populous pickings for non student-athletes. NKU will always be there (unless the OVC wakes up and extends an offer [you heard it here first!]) and Bellarmine stands awaiting to bring in the basketball crazed Louisville market.

[BCPanther]

We're a one bid league going forward. Adding anybody is stupid until we have a clear picture of what the NCAA is going to look like.

The A10 and Mountain West (when San Diego State wins the tournament) are in the same boat...

[BEARZ77]

You have to be very careful when adding teams, diluting the league schedule and further limiting the OOC one. A good example is WBB this year. Missouri State, Drake, and to some degree UNI and now Belmont , are teams that schedule aggressively in the non con and often have shots at an at large bid. MSU has been eligible for 4 of the last 5 NCAA's making it twice as MVC tourney champs, but also eligible twice as at large. That's rare in MM basketball. But this year the league has Missouri State only playing UNI and Drake once each, that robs Drake and UNI of a top [Q1/Q2 ] game, but MSU of two [Q1/Q2] games. Plus it saddles each of those 3 with the guarantee of 8 games vs the lower tiered teams which will be Q3/Q4 types. That alone could be the difference in an at large opportunity for any of the three.

[TylerDurden]

Potentially unpopular opinion:

The Valley already has too many members or, at the very least, the wrong membership mix.

Adding more to this group isn't a viable option. I'd listen to a proposal to reshuffle, but that won't happen.

[Chuck A]

Potentially unpopular opinion:

The Valley already has too many members or, at the very least, the wrong membership mix.

Adding more to this group isn't a viable option. I'd listen to a proposal to reshuffle, but that won't happen.

What do you mean “reshuffle”?