The debate for third place is open.

[LMS]

Ethan Wragge 6'7" (medical redshirt) Will Artino 6' 11" legit 4 (redshirt) Geoff Groeselle 6' 11" frosh

So which one of those guys are proven at D1 level? I'm not sure what your response means or am I sure if you actually understood what I wrote. That may be my fault, who knows.

Again, outside of CU who else in the league can with confidence claim to have an obvious advantage over WSU at the 4/5?

Wragge broke Kyle Korver's three point record for freshman at CU two years ago. He's a proven shooter at least.

[uniftw]

I guess we'll see. I wasn't too impressed with UNI's bigs after O'Rear went down last year. It was pretty much Kwadzo carrying the team whenever he could, along with an occasional James or Koch pick up.

The thing about O'Rear going down is that it wouldn't have been as big of a loss had we not had an All-American post player de-commit and go to a conference rival. Would that have prevented everything that happened at that point? No, but it would have made the transition a hell of a lot easier.

UNI will have more size this year than they did last, and more athleticism. The problem will be that UNI's post players will be very young. Pehl will be a rJr, Jake will be a rJr (but has been more of a 15ft and out player), rank will be a Soph (but is slightly undersized at 6'6), and after that it is 6'8 rFr or true freshman.

Size won't be the issue, experience will be for the post. However, UNI will have 4 players back with starting expereience with Johnny, AJ, Sonnen, and Pehl.

This year may be a 4-6 finish for UNI. However, with only 1 senior, 4 juniors, and then 3 sophomores, 2 rfr, and 6 true freshman the future is good.

[DoubleJayAlum]

I don't know that I buy that UNI's posts are so much younger than everybody else's. In fact they look to be the same age as Creightons (redshirt Jr, soph, frosh, rfrosh).

[valleychamp]

I don't know that I buy that UNI's posts are so much younger than everybody else's. In fact they look to be the same age as Creightons (redshirt Jr, soph, frosh, rfrosh).

The only posts that UNI has coming back are Pehl (not very good), Rank (soph who is only 6-6), and Koch (not really a "post" player despite his size)

The true post talent that UNI will rely on in years to come consists of Nate Buss (RFr), Seth Tuttle (Fr), Chris Olivier (Fr), and Marvin Singleton (Fr). None of those guys have played a second of college basketball.

[2livewu]

I know this is going to seem like I am contradicting myself but here goes.

Wragge is the main reason I pick CU to win the conference. He can stretch defenses like few others, has experience and is a smart player. He gives CU a uniqueness type player that few other Valley teams can claim. Combined with Greg E and Little Mac (2 more players that nobody really can match up with) that's just a bit too much to overcome. I don't see Creighton losing more than 3 games in conference, at the most. I think WSU has to split with CU and lose just 1 other game to take the title, and that's not going to happen. And WSU is the only team that's capable of challenging the Jays (man that hurts to say that).

The one thing about Wragge is that unless he has improved A LOT, he can't guard anything near a legitimate 4. Ever. He is not a good defensive player. He is a fantastic shooter, an amazing shooter. If he has improved a ton on defense, CU is probably unstoppable in the league.

Any fan of UNI, Evansville, Indiana State or MSU (to say nothing of the projected bottom 4) that thinks they have any more than a fleeting chance at the Jays doesn't understand basketball or just has a really bad case of tunnel vision.

[glm38]

I know this is going to seem like I am contradicting myself but here goes.

Wragge is the main reason I pick CU to win the conference. He can stretch defenses like few others, has experience and is a smart player. He gives CU a uniqueness type player that few other Valley teams can claim. Combined with Greg E and Little Mac (2 more players that nobody really can match up with) that's just a bit too much to overcome. I don't see Creighton losing more than 3 games in conference, at the most. I think WSU has to split with CU and lose just 1 other game to take the title, and that's not going to happen. And WSU is the only team that's capable of challenging the Jays (man that hurts to say that).

The one thing about Wragge is that unless he has improved A LOT, he can't guard anything near a legitimate 4. Ever. He is not a good defensive player. He is a fantastic shooter, an amazing shooter. If he has improved a ton on defense, CU is probably unstoppable in the league.

Any fan of UNI, Evansville, Indiana State or MSU (to say nothing of the projected bottom 4) that thinks they have any more than a fleeting chance at the Jays doesn't understand basketball or just has a really bad case of tunnel vision.

CU was 10-8 in the conference last year. I just don't see how that translates into them being almost unbeatable this coming year?

[Haha]

nm

[Haha]

CU was 10-8 in the conference last year. I just don't see how that translates into them being almost unbeatable this coming year?

What was MSU's record before last seasons 15-3?

[glm38]

CU was 10-8 in the conference last year. I just don't see how that translates into them being almost unbeatable this coming year?

What was MSU's record before last seasons 15-3?

Fairly similar at 8-10. I see your point. But that doesn't always translate. Several MSU players really improved their game in 2011 and the Bears just came together as a team. You can't really predict that type of thing can you?. I agree CU should be very good. They may very well win the Valley. But I don't see them as untouchable at all. Even for the aforementioned Northern Iowa, MSU, etc.

[MoValley John]

CU was 10-8 in the conference last year. I just don't see how that translates into them being almost unbeatable this coming year?

What was MSU's record before last seasons 15-3?

Fairly similar at 8-10. I see your point. But that doesn't always translate. Several MSU players really improved their game in 2011 and the Bears just came together as a team. You can't really predict that type of thing can you?. I agree CU should be very good. They may very well win the Valley. But I don't see them as untouchable at all. Even for the aforementioned Northern Iowa, MSU, etc.

How is that? How doesn't it translate? I don't remember if the fans on this site picked MSU 2nd or 3rd last year. There wasn't much argument. Fans picked a big jump based on who Missouri State had coming back and are now using similar criteria to what appears fans picking Creighton 1st or 2nd this year. There was little argument last year when fans picked a big jump in MSU, and the fans turned out to be correct. This year, however, when fans do similar prognosticating for Creighton, there is some flaw in our rationale???