MVC Games Week 14

[goramblers2011]

A10 has consistently gotten more bids than the MVC over the past 10 or so years. Whether the A10 is consistently better statistically, that's a bit more debatable. The bottom of the A10 really drags it down (hence why you often see fans of top A10 teams advocate for schools like Fordham and LaSalle to drop down to the America East or comparable conferences). As to whether the A10 gets more bids due to "east coast bias" or because its top 3 or 4 teams are better than the MVC's top 3 or 4 teams or some other reason, the fact remains that being in the A10 gives you a better shot at an at-large.

Both conferences will be better than the AAC once Houston joins the B12. We should really be celebrating that

[Blers42]

I do not understand why the MVC fanbase always seems to sound like a bride left at the altar? Loyola left, it happens. So did Wichita St and Creighton, get over it and stop sounding like a slighted lover.

I mean, sorry for defending the MVC on an MVC message board against BS claims about the A10 being "consistently better for decades." If you ask me Rambler fans on here get sensitive when the superiority of the A10 gets questioned. I think there's not much disagreement about the institutional fit.

This entire conversation started because of people trashing Loyola’s decision to go to the A10 in this thread, so do you expect us not to stand up for our program? “BS claim”, go look at kenpom or check the history of the number of auto bids over the past decade. It’s common knowledge that the A10 has been ranked above the MVC more times than not over the past decade. When I said Statistically, I was referring to kenpom. I should have been more specific. Thank Freddycat for starting this then acting like (he/she/they) are above it.

One can only take so much ignorant trolling.

[Mikovio]

A10 has consistently gotten more bids than the MVC over the past 10 or so years. Whether the A10 is consistently better statistically, that's a bit more debatable. The bottom of the A10 really drags it down (hence why you often see fans of top A10 teams advocate for schools like Fordham and LaSalle to drop down to the America East or comparable conferences). As to whether the A10 gets more bids due to "east coast bias" or because its top 3 or 4 teams are better than the MVC's top 3 or 4 teams or some other reason, the fact remains that being in the A10 gives you a better shot at an at-large.

Both conferences will be better than the AAC once Houston joins the B12. We should really be celebrating that

That's reasonable. Yes, the A10 has consistently gotten more bids than the MVC the last decade (though last year was tied, and in 2020 only Dayton was a lock from the A10 and Richmond and UNI were both on the bubble so that could have been a close call). Although the A10 has had 14 members to the MVC's 10, and some of those years were 3:2, which is virtually a wash.

[tribecalledquest]

I do not understand why the MVC fanbase always seems to sound like a bride left at the altar? Loyola left, it happens. So did Wichita St and Creighton, get over it and stop sounding like a slighted lover.

I mean, sorry for defending the MVC on an MVC message board against BS claims about the A10 being "consistently better for decades." If you ask me Rambler fans on here get sensitive when the superiority of the A10 gets questioned. I think there's not much disagreement about the institutional fit.

This entire conversation started because of people trashing Loyola’s decision to go to the A10 in this thread, so do you expect us not to stand up for our program? “BS claim”, go look at kenpom or check the history of the number of auto bids over the past decade. It’s common knowledge that the A10 has been ranked above the MVC more times than not over the past decade. When I said Statistically, I was referring to kenpom. I should have been more specific. Thank Freddycat for starting this then acting like (he/she/they) are above it.

One can only take so much ignorant trolling.

No one "trashed" their decision. At least I didn't see it. Everyone agreed they understand the move from a cultural, educational and religious fit. The question is about the A10 vs the MVC in basketball and how that relates to Loyola.

And fans of EVERY league get defensive when being compared to other similar leagues. Some of it isn't rational.

I personally feel the A10 is buying high on Loyola and it's better days on the hardwood are behind them. Porter Moser was smart to get out when he did. Of course I could be 100% wrong.

[unipanther99]

I don't think anyone is trashing the decision to leave, but definitely some less than warm feelings toward the program in general after their short stint with the conference. Can't really fault that, can you?

Basically, thanks for using your time in the MVC to improve your program far beyond what it was before, thanks for the NCAA shares, and please send a few more on your way out. Other than that, good luck and bye-bye.

This is different from when WSU or Creighton left, as they had been part of this conference for decades and formed deep rivalries with some of our schools. Those losses were felt deeply. This is more of a shrug, at least for me.

[goramblers2011]

I don't think anyone is trashing the decision to leave, but definitely some less than warm feelings toward the program in general after their short stint with the conference. Can't really fault that, can you?

Basically, thanks for using your time in the MVC to improve your program far beyond what it was before, thanks for the NCAA shares, and please send a few more on your way out. Other than that, good luck and bye-bye.

This is different from when WSU or Creighton left, as they had been part of this conference for decades and formed deep rivalries with some of our schools. Those losses were felt deeply. This is more of a shrug, at least for me.

I think this is a fair reaction. I also don't think you'll find any Rambler fans trashing the Valley or Valley schools on our way out (unlike Wichita fans...). The Valley did a lot for Loyola and, I like to think, Loyola did a decent job representing the Valley in its short stint (especially those NCAA units....).

I also think almost every Rambler fan would want to continue scheduling most Valley schools in non-conf, especially those where some rivalries have developed (Drake, UNI, etc.). Even better if the top Valley schools continue to be subpar in non-conf and then hit their stride during MVC play!

[BCPanther]

I think we got Loyola's peak and are replacing them with two programs that have done it over the long haul that are going to be helped in every way by Valley membership. Plus we kept a (much more diverse) presence in Chicago.

Win-Win-Win for the Valley.

9 years in the league with 4 of them being completely forgettable and an overall league record that is just barely going to creep above .500. This just isn't the big loss that Loyola fans want it to be. Best of luck to you.

[Blers42]

No one "trashed" their decision. At least I didn't see it. Everyone agreed they understand the move from a cultural, educational and religious fit. The question is about the A10 vs the MVC in basketball and how that relates to Loyola.

And fans of EVERY league get defensive when being compared to other similar leagues. Some of it isn't rational.

I personally feel the A10 is buying high on Loyola and it's better days on the hardwood are behind them. Porter Moser was smart to get out when he did. Of course I could be 100% wrong.

Ok so you start this post by saying no one trashed their decision, then saying at least you didn’t. Speaking for all, then saying you actually have no clue other than yourself. Go look at the first page of this thread, “the move was short sighted and dumb, good riddance Loyola”.

I never once stated the A10 was far and away the better league, but as of lately they’ve been more successful getting to the tournament and seem to get more respect from the media. When people bash the move and s*** talk Loyola I’m going to defend them as I’d expect most super fans would do.

I think the move was good for Loyola. I think the A10 gives Loyola better odds to get into the tournament each year and the culture fit is obvious. Majority of basketball analytics have ranked the A10 above the MVC in recent years, that could change because the disparity is not that large. With Murray State and Belmont joining the MVC I think the gap gets even smaller. Did Loyola know either was going to join when they left? Where both going to join/get invited if Loyola didn’t leave? Would that have changed Loyola’s mind about leaving? Those are all questions that I don’t know and if I did, it would help me evaluate the decision to leave better.

It’s fair to assume that Loyola’s glory days are behind them, most would think that after a mid-major goes to the final four and loses the head coach that took them there that there is going to be a regression. They seem to be doing fine this year after losing their HC and star player. Not to mention Loyola is recruiting better than ever. The school has invested in the program and Porter left it in a substantially better place than he found it, so I think the program will be fine in the A10. Like you all have stated the bottom feeders there are atrocious anyways, so it’s not like Loyola is going to be below them. If the level of competition is really as close as you all make it seem to be, then how could possibly going to a conference that the media seems to like more and that receives more auto bids be bad for a program? If we use the logic that Loyola isn’t going to do well in the A10 but the level of competition is the same, then that means they wouldn’t have done well if they stayed in the MVC. So what does it even matter? You might as well go to the place that historically has had better odds to make the tourney. I like the Valley, I didn’t make this choice but I can understand why they made it. I’m just tired of the jabs and reacted, I’m over it now after getting that out.

[BCPanther]

No one "trashed" their decision. At least I didn't see it. Everyone agreed they understand the move from a cultural, educational and religious fit. The question is about the A10 vs the MVC in basketball and how that relates to Loyola.

And fans of EVERY league get defensive when being compared to other similar leagues. Some of it isn't rational.

I personally feel the A10 is buying high on Loyola and it's better days on the hardwood are behind them. Porter Moser was smart to get out when he did. Of course I could be 100% wrong.

Ok so you start this post by saying no one trashed their decision, then saying at least you didn’t. Speaking for all, then saying you actually have no clue other than yourself. Go look at the first page of this thread, “the move was short sighted and dumb, good riddance Loyola”.

I never once stated the A10 was far and away the better league, but as of lately they’ve been more successful getting to the tournament and seem to get more respect from the media. When people bash the move and s*** talk Loyola I’m going to defend them as I’d expect most super fans would do.

I think the move was good for Loyola. I think the A10 gives Loyola better odds to get into the tournament each year and the culture fit is obvious. Majority of basketball analytics have ranked the A10 above the MVC in recent years, that could change because the disparity is not that large. With Murray State and Belmont joining the MVC I think the gap gets even smaller. Did Loyola know either was going to join when they left? Where both going to join/get invited if Loyola didn’t leave? Would that have changed Loyola’s mind about leaving? Those are all questions that I don’t know and if I did, it would help me evaluate the decision to leave better.

It’s fair to assume that Loyola’s glory days are behind them, most would think that after a mid-major goes to the final four and loses the head coach that took them there that there is going to be a regression. They seem to be doing fine this year after losing their HC and star player. Not to mention Loyola is recruiting better than ever. The school has invested in the program and Porter left it in a substantially better place than he found it, so I think the program will be fine in the A10. Like you all have stated the bottom feeders there are atrocious anyways, so it’s not like Loyola is going to be below them. If the level of competition is really as close as you all make it seem to be, then how could possibly going to a conference that the media seems to like more and that receives more auto bids be bad for a program? If we use the logic that Loyola isn’t going to do well in the A10 but the level of competition is the same, then that means they wouldn’t have done well if they stayed in the MVC. So what does it even matter? You might as well go to the place that historically has had better odds to make the tourney. I like the Valley, I didn’t make this choice but I can understand why they made it.

They knew Belmont was coming because the Loyola admin was consulted on adding them and it was announced before Loyola's move was. Had Loyola stayed, Murray, Arlington and Kansas City are probably the adds to get to 14.

Loyola wasn't exactly the most forthcoming on their plans to the league either so the 'just saw it as a better opportunity' card doesn't hold up great either. Loyola told Jackson that they'd inquired about being a basketball only member in the AAC and it wasn't a fit but must've forgotten they were talking to the A10 at the same time they were helping the expansion committee make decisions.

Again, I don't begrudge Loyola for leaving. Go East. Go join the other Jesuits. Let Sister Jean have her East Coast Rock Star Nun Tour.

Just don't expect us to be heartbroken over it.

[Blers42]

Fair enough, I would never expect anywhere here outside of Loyola fans to care about Loyola outside of being in the MVC. Similar to how I don't care about the other programs in the MVC.

Also I was not aware of a lot of those details you pointed out. I think Sister Meme would prefer to call it the Sister Jean East Coast Jesuit Jam Tour.