Another Expansion/Realignment Thread

[Aces44]

I would take Wright State and Milwaukee over both UTA and KC. My objection to UTA isn't even program related so much as geography. I want good programs in a compact footprint. I know anyone can fly to DFW but flights aren't cheap and the idea of playing conference games in Texas doesn't really excite fans on either side of this equation. UTA doesn't draw. Wright State and Milwaukee do and they're of roughly similar quality to UTA as programs I believe (especially if Milwaukee can continue its upward trajectory).

There you go again, speaking for everybody else! How do you know the 1% of each Valley team's alumni won't be excited to see their alma mater play live? They could be very excited!

Now that Coach Nagy is gone, and the problems they've had financially, I wouldn't dare touch Wright State. I also don't think you're gonna get your nice and snug, comfy footprint. There's nothing else in Indiana, Illinois and Iowa. The Valley has tapped into Kentucky, but I think it doesn't want to become a Southern leaning Conference.

I don’t mean to be smug, bc I respect your opinion; but catering to 1% of your population isn’t a strong strategy imho

[BCPanther]

If you want to play Horizon League teams, I'm sure the Horizon League would take you back...

[ReZyNeZy]

Cmon people! We're better than this! Name calling and insults get you nowhere. Lets get down to the brass tacks. Being a mid major conference doenst usually come with the luxury of high amounts of casual fans. People would just rather go onto the TV and watch whatever Big Name University is playing near them. I agree with Aces44. 1% isnt just a low number, its the lowest number there is. Unless you have the money to toss around, you arent going to fly all the way to Texas just to catch a mid major basketball game. Mid Majors dont have a ton of fans in other parts of the US and Arlington fans sure dont want to have their closest away game being a 10 hour drive to Murray or SIU.

Also, this notion that HL teams are "untouchables" is interesting to say the least. If a team has the fanbase and the skill to compete, why shouldn't they be invited if they fit within the market? What league they are from should be the lowest concern on the list.

[Drakey]

I think Milwaukee and St. Thomas have the most potential of the teams being discussed. Much bettter off with non-football schools in big cities.

[VUGrad1314]

I'm not just about HL teams. My favorite candidate on the shortlist is St Thomas. And I can't help that many of the options with the best fundamentals happen to be HL teams. NKU Wright State and Milwaukee bring strong budgets strong or improving performance and most importantly they draw. Putting any of these schools in the MVC probably only helps. Plus they can help MVX
C institutions recruit students. And spending less on travel helps the league.

My preference is
1. St Thomas
2. NKU
Big drop (and only if we go to 14 which I don't even necessarily advocate for unless these schools put together a string of strong years
3. Wright State
4. Milwaukee
Big drop
5. UTA
Big drop
6 Kansas City

[Chuck A]

I would take Wright State and Milwaukee over both UTA and KC. My objection to UTA isn't even program related so much as geography. I want good programs in a compact footprint. I know anyone can fly to DFW but flights aren't cheap and the idea of playing conference games in Texas doesn't really excite fans on either side of this equation. UTA doesn't draw. Wright State and Milwaukee do and they're of roughly similar quality to UTA as programs I believe (especially if Milwaukee can continue its upward trajectory).

There you go again, speaking for everybody else! How do you know the 1% of each Valley team's alumni won't be excited to see their alma mater play live? They could be very excited!

Now that Coach Nagy is gone, and the problems they've had financially, I wouldn't dare touch Wright State. I also don't think you're gonna get your nice and snug, comfy footprint. There's nothing else in Indiana, Illinois and Iowa. The Valley has tapped into Kentucky, but I think it doesn't want to become a Southern leaning Conference.

I don’t mean to be smug, bc I respect your opinion; but catering to 1% of your population isn’t a strong strategy imho

I would agree with you, but with the impending enrollment cliff happening, the Presidents are focusing on regular student enrollment. I don't think it's catering as much as it is reminding, marketing to, and rekindling a smoldering, if not burned out Flame (pun intended!) in, its alumni. For example (and it might not be a good one), UIC has a living alumni population of 335,000. So about 335 alumni live in Arlington. UIC has been introduced to the Arlington market. Say the Flames come to town and an alumnus comes and bring their children or other relatives/friends. Maybe, just maybe the Flames and the city of Chicago sparks interest in a potential student. UIC's out-of-state tuition is $28,654, ~$14,000 more than in-state. That's over $114,000 for a 4-year matriculation. Yeah, not that big of a deal, but it's a start. Also, being in the market and on Bally Sports Southwest, the Conference is now seen in Texas, Arkansas, Northern Louisiana and parts of New Mexico.

[jsaluki080]

I'm against UTA.
Here is my thoughts as to why.
- large travel cost
- low faith they'd stick around long. I have this nagging feeling that we would be nothing more than a stepping stone, a temporary pit stop,
.
.
I guess that's it. I guess I just fear our schools paying lots for travel cost just for them to leave 5 or 6 years later

[Chuck A]

I'm against UTA.
Here is my thoughts as to why.
- large travel cost
- low faith they'd stick around long. I have this nagging feeling that we would be nothing more than a stepping stone, a temporary pit stop,
.
.
I guess that's it. I guess I just fear our schools paying lots for travel cost just for them to leave 5 or 6 years later

I appreciate your concern, but what makes you think we’d be a stepping stone? Without football, UTA is less appealing to other leagues. That’s the reason they and Little Rock were kicked out of the Sun Belt in the first place. Where is UTA going? What are its choices?

I get the travel costs as well, but I can be almost sure that the schedulers will have teams traveling to Arlington once every other year. Some maybe every two years. I think to some extent, travel costs are a bit overrated.

[jsaluki080]

I'm against UTA.
Here is my thoughts as to why.
- large travel cost
- low faith they'd stick around long. I have this nagging feeling that we would be nothing more than a stepping stone, a temporary pit stop,
.
.
I guess that's it. I guess I just fear our schools paying lots for travel cost just for them to leave 5 or 6 years later

I appreciate your concern, but what makes you think we’d be a stepping stone? Without football, UTA is less appealing to other leagues. That’s the reason they and Little Rock were kicked out of the Sun Belt in the first place. Where is UTA going? What are its choices?

I get the travel costs as well, but I can be almost sure that the schedulers will have teams traveling to Arlington once every other year. Some maybe every two years. I think to some extent, travel costs are a bit overrated.

I know UTA doesn't have footbal..... for now. But after a few good years in the MVC, a few wealthy donors (and i'm sure there are plenty in Arlington) will decide UTA needs football (It's Texas anyways) and make a big push.
My concerns are probably baseless and if they were to join, I hope my concerns would be wrong.

[TylerDurden]

I would agree with you, but with the impending enrollment cliff happening, the Presidents are focusing on regular student enrollment. I don't think it's catering as much as it is reminding, marketing to, and rekindling a smoldering, if not burned out Flame (pun intended!) in, its alumni. For example (and it might not be a good one), UIC has a living alumni population of 335,000. So about 335 alumni live in Arlington. UIC has been introduced to the Arlington market. Say the Flames come to town and an alumnus comes and bring their children or other relatives/friends. Maybe, just maybe the Flames and the city of Chicago sparks interest in a potential student. UIC's out-of-state tuition is $28,654, ~$14,000 more than in-state. That's over $114,000 for a 4-year matriculation. Yeah, not that big of a deal, but it's a start. Also, being in the market and on Bally Sports Southwest, the Conference is now seen in Texas, Arkansas, Northern Louisiana and parts of New Mexico.

This is the pipe dream that the Horizon League has been trying to sell forever. This idea that playing in Cleveland is going to draw students for Oakland, or playing in Detroit was going to draw students for UIC, or playing in Chicago is going to draw students for Wright State.

Go look at the enrollment demographics. It doesn't happen like they sell it.

Absent a top-rated academic program or some tuition reciprocity, there are very few incentives for anyone to go to an out-of-state public university.

There's more of a case to be made for private schools, but the fact is that the private schools in the MVC are regional universities. Some have outstanding academic programs and draw students for them, but that doesn't require them to play in DFW or Minneapolis.