Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

[ptownbraves]

The MVC was steadfast in not making moves to disproportionately benefit the western block (Wichita State and before they left, Creighton and Tulsa) for 3 decades despite those schools representing an outsized portion of fan support and Tournament credits. Instead, moves were made to concentrate the benefits with the balance of the schools to the westerners detriment (keeping Arch Madness in STL despite repeated lobbying to rotate with KC, adding Loyola, rotating the baseball tournament at host sites with a de-emphasis on attendance and bid size (hurting WSU and MSU), etc.).

The MVC committed to its current direction and geographic footprint a long time ago.

It's hilarious you're bringing up location of events as a reason for WSU feeling slighted. Remind me again how much Wichita's travel time and expenses will decrease next year?

Apples to oranges, but the AAC Tournament rotates and the rumored 2019 site is Tulsa. WSU fans would be thrilled with that outcome.

STL was simply an illustration of one of many, many moves which shifted the geographic focus of the conference in a way that favored the eastern block over the western block. Tulsa, WSU's biggest rival for 50 years and natural travel partner leaves, and is replaced with Evansville, a school near the edge of the eastern time zone. It's not that one decision alone was necessarily a huge deal but instead shows a divergence of interests over several decades.

So who would you have wanted to replace Tulsa? What about Creighton? You have to be realistic about the fact that there just aren't as many schools West of the Mississippi.

[mvfcfan]

Yeah Wichita State was so mistreated. It could be that our tournament is in St Louis because our conference's office happens to be there. It is also a 6 hour drive from Wichita to St Louis or you can fly to St Louis from Wichita and be there in an hour. That's tragic.

Maybe if there was more in Kansas and Oklahoma than dead grass and cows we could add some teams out there, but unfortunately there is not. If we would have added Oral Roberts or UMKC, instead of Loyola or E'Ville you all would still be complaining. Just get out already. We're tired of hearing all of these sad excuses as to why Wichita is leaving.

I don't miss Creighton and I won't miss Wichita either. I'm just glad that next year we are guaranteed to have a team in the NCAA Tournament that is proud to represent the MVC and not a team that openly wants to leave.

And don't act surprised that we are not all sad that Wichita is leaving. Your fanbase has been trashing our conference for the past several years. If Wichita had all the sudden got an invitation to the AAC and you all left that would be understandable. But trashing the conference for years and openly saying how you all need to go to a better conference isn't something we will miss. Murray State and Valpo fans are excited that they might be joining the MVC. Those are the kinds of teams and fanbases I want around. That and they are both schools that are serious about their basketball programs.

[Play Angry]

There certainly are fewer options. I recall hearing that WSU, CU (despite concerns over public/private split) and then-SMSU lobbied for UALR at that time but were summarily dismissed and Evansville was pushed through instead.

I think you're trying to create a bit of an argument where there isn't much of one. I did not say the MVC was in conspiracy to royally eff WSU at every turn or something similar, and if that was your read on my posts, you were wrong. I don't think it's very controversial that many of the decisions made had a disproportionately negative impact on WSU and its western peers, whether that was intended or not, over the span of thirty or so years. It's a byproduct of the conscious decision to focus on a narrower geographic footprint, with budget concerns undoubtedly playing a role for some members.

[All-MVC Fan]

It's a shame that Wichita is leaving the Valley. It's ok to admit that, too! They brought the Valley exposure like it hasn't seen in decades, for an extended period of time. But they are now gone. Let's all wish them well in the AAC and then move forward together.

Goodbye Shockers! Good luck in the AAC, and thanks for all you did for the MVC while you were here!!!

There is no need to continue discussing why any former school left, as that's all in the past. We must look to the future with the hope that the league makes the right decision for adding new schools to OUR conference.

I suggest we return to the subject at hand and talk about OUR future, instead of someone else's past. No disrespect intended (at all, as I've been clear on here as to my feelings for Wichita State), but it's becoming tiring reading about schools no longer a part of the discussion.

We should be discussing Murray State, Valpo, Milwaukee, et al, and slamming on the league office. You know, stick with what we're good at!!!

[jacksfan29]

An idle thought that's relevant to the Dakotas.

Let's assume Murray and Valpo are 10 and 11, and let's say Omaha is #12. Unlikely, but possible.

Summit loses Omaha...and the Horizon probably raids the Summit to replace Valpo (either IUPUI or IPFW. Heck, maybe both).

Then the Summit is down to:
the 4 Dakotas
Oral Bob
Denver
WIU

That's danger zone territory.

In an extreme case, the Horizon takes both Indiana schools, and WIU decides to bail to a conference like the OVC. Oral Bob was in the Southland before, maybe they bail if membership dwindles. Denver can easily bail to the WAC. There is a chain reaction out there which does result in the end of the Summit if things break the wrong way. It does require a combination of Omaha + Horizon League teams, but it's out there.

HAHA losing IUPUI, IPFW, WIU would strengthen the Summit. You guys keep slumming it with big additions like Loyola, Murray St, Milwaukee... if MVC doesn't take the Dakota's you're crazy and you caved to the Private schools. Summit will be as good as MVC if not already outside of UNI.

The point isn't that the Summit would shed the dead weight...it would be that there would be literally no one left to be in the conference.

Which is fine, we will go west and the MVFC is dead. The current MVC football playing schools can go PFL or drop the sport.

[TheAsianSensation]

Which is fine, we will go west and the MVFC is dead. The current MVC football playing schools can go PFL or drop the sport.

MVCF should survive with 5 schools plus Murray and Youngstown...it'd certainly be the death of the conference as a major player in FCS, but I'm wondering if that would be a good thing for the MVC as a whole.

Either way this is obviously a far-fetched scenario, but one of those things to keep in the back of your mind if the Horizon gets frisky in trying to replace Valpo.

[mvfcfan]

I also highly doubt that Western Illinois would go along with the Dakota teams, so that would still leave the MVFC at 8 teams. They have been in the MVFC a long time and football is their most important sport. If anything I think they would most likely go to the Horizon League for all sports.

However I really don't see a scenario where the Dakota schools leave the MVFC. They don't have enough teams for an auto bid and North Dakota just recently joined the MVFC. I don't think the Dakota schools are going anywhere.

[Lakesbison]

NDSU is gone at first invite to Mountain West or MAC.

NDSU football does not belong at this level whatsoever. problem is NDSU has beaten 3 teams from each of those conference and they've basically refused to schedule us since. It sucks being so good that teams wont invite you because they don't want you to dominate your conference. . . sounds familiar....hmmm

[uniftw]

Here's the reality for the Summit teams if it gets crazy - they are F-ed.

Let's play this out with the MVC taking Valpo, Milwaukee and Murray State.

1. Horizon will want/need 2 teams. What two teams are in their footprint that would be easy adds that don't really fit their current conference? Gee. I think that's IUPUI and Fort Wayne. The Summit is down from 9 to 7 teams - remember minimum for an at-large is 6

2. The OVC is going to be looking for a school to replace Murray State. It depends on if they want a football school. A prime candidate would be WIU. WIU is now the EXTREME eastern edge of the Summit. They offer football, which would keep the OVC at 9 FB members - 8 conference games in an 11 game schedule. They are a perfect travel partner for EIU.

Summit is now down to 6 members. Still have an AL but it's tenuous. You are now also scheduling 20 freaking OOC games for basketball. 20. That's not possible. Chances are you'd end up playing each conference team 3 times and rotating who gets 2 home games vs 1 road game every other year.

Then lets talk about starting Summit League football to make up for it. You need football schools because you don't have enough teams for a football AQ bid (remember, you need 6). Your conference would be UND, NDSU, SDSU, USD, UNO, ORU and Denver. Those last three don't play football. You need AT LEAST 1 more football member. Realistically you need 4 to make scheduling happen correctly. Let's pretend Denver doesn't peace out to the WAC or WCC or Big West because the Summit falling apart.

The names, from NDSU/SDSU fans I talk to on the reg are Northern Colorado, Southern Utah Weber State for football. Let's pretend all 4 join. You are then at 10 members with 8 playing football. Do you really trust Denver? I guess they have their "travel partner" in Northern Colorado. Is that really that great of a conference? Is that worth blowing up the MVFC for? You're replacing UNI, ISUr, YSU, SIU, MSU, WIU, ISUb with 3 programs all worse than ISUb. You're conference footprint? Man, enjoy sending all your sports to Ogden and Cedar City Utah and then Greeley and Denver CO and then still down to Oklahoma. When looking at those travel bills, remember that UND left the Big Sky - a similar footprint - because they were going bankrupt from that travel costs. For those unfamiliar with those locations - https://drive.google.com/open?id=1b7lgM ... sp=sharing

Meanwhile the MVFC has UNI, SIU, MSU, ISUR, ISUB, YSU and MSU as it's base. It keeps it's AQ from the start and doesn't have to worry about the NCAA allowing yet another waiver to bypass the NCAAs continuity rule. It doesn't have to worry about the NCAA allowing another conference to start to support football. Hell, maybe the Horizon would take WIU and that would leave WIU in the MVFC for football. That gives us 8 members from the start.


See, here's the thing about all of the s*** talk you try to post on here and AGS and team specific sites, none of it is grounded in any kind of reality. It's all grounded in this strange complex completely detached from how things actually work. You want to know something funny - since NDSU/SDSU fans love to talk about broke MVC schools - SDSU funds it's football program at the lowest level in the MVFC at under 3 million. NDSU and UND are facing record budget cuts. The reality is, as unstable as you all want to think the MVC is, it's quite stable. We have programs/schools literally begging their BOR to let them make a move. Meanwhile, people can't get out of the Summit fast enough. The SL is legitimately 3 conference moves away from having to merge with the WAC to avoid complete shut down, especially if the angst against the MVFC continues to grow from the Dakota's like it is.

[Fargobison]

The last time the Summit League explored football, NDSU told the conference to pound sand. NDSU is not going to put its football program in some bare bones league, it would be a scheduling nightmare and would put NDSU's football program at risk. This is a program that through its booster group funds every single scholarship for every single student athlete at the school, plus full cost of attendance. The school is very careful with what it does with its football program.

99.9% of NDSU fans want nothing to do with the kind of Summit League football ideas that got tossed around, don't confuse us with SDSU fans that seem to have some kind of Mount Rushmore sized chip on their shoulder regarding the MVC. For the school to ever consider a change of football conference it would require having other FCS powers on board like the Montana's.

There is some reality to the situation, Summit League football isn't going to happen anytime soon. You need 8-10 football schools committed to make it work and to get NDSU's attention the UNC's and SUU's of the world isn't going to cut it.