Wichita State #16 in USA Today preseason poll

[Wufan]

Embarrassed.

[shoxrox]

I'm embarrassed that you'd rather back up an MSU clown, who constantly bashes and tries to one-up WSU (but fails). I'm glad you felt the need to interject in a thread that you asked only hours earlier"when will it end". Well hypocrite, you're now right in the middle of it.

When you remove your foot from your mouth and your hand from the back side of every other Valley fan, then you can play the embarrassment card.

[shoxrox]

Slight change of subject, but a great nugget from BEARZ a year ago:

I'd bet a beer or two in St. Louis 4 years from now, that the names Thurman and Marshall will have caused much more opponent angst than Baker and Van Fleet.

Obviously, not a homer, and a wealth of knowledge. Also a post Wufan would agree with.

[mvcfan]

Spoken like a fan of a losing program would say. When you win, you earn the right to talk. But of course as a fan of a school that hasn't won anything in a while, and certainly hasn't won anything to the magnitude of a Final Four, you're going to disagree.

You look like an Evansville fan when you're coming off a season where you went 0-fer in the non-con, losing to a SWAC school and talking like you're hot sh**. Evansville hasn't even performed that bad before.

Know who you are and your place.

And to add insult to injury, you're the one who started all of this yourself so don't come back with the "I'm just an innocent little girl who got picked on and is standing up for herself" line.

Nice try, but unfortunately I didn't even post in this thread until page 4 by which time you had already thrown about 6-7 posts with your constant anti CU rant into the fray. I just picked up on what others had already pointed out about your obsession. And I think you clearly proved my point with your above putdown of innocent Evansville and your belief that other Universities posters "have a place ". My place is to post whatever I chose and to not think that just because your chosen University is enjoying a nice run of success that it entitles you to a status abo ve anyone else on this board. Talk about an arrogant a-hole.

Bear- I just don't get why you'd join in with Creighton who has left our league against a poster (even if you don't like them) of a team that presently in our league. The Creighton posters are often coming here to bait others and point out their superiority to our league. It just seems ignorant tand short sighted to me.

[glm38]

Slight change of subject, but a great nugget from BEARZ a year ago:

I'd bet a beer or two in St. Louis 4 years from now, that the names Thurman and Marshall will have caused much more opponent angst than Baker and Van Fleet.

Obviously, not a homer, and a wealth of knowledge. Also a post Wufan would agree with.

I'm a homer but looking at it objectively bearz statement isn't outlandish at all.

So far Baker looks like a total stud but that's based on just a half season or less. Marshal was just as impressive, was FOY and proved his worth over a whole season. Given Bakers performance in the tournament I'd rate that one even. Van fleet was good but was pretty up and down as the backup PG. Thurman had an up and down season too with several very good games. Van fleet was probably more consistent IMO so slight advantage there. Both players have a ton of upside/potential. Actually all 4 do.

So overall after one year slight advantage to WSU's guys. But Bearz was talking after 4 years. IMO all 4 are (or will be) very good MVC players. Who knows which duo ends up being better? It could easily go either way.

[moshock]

Now you just sound like a crying, defiant toddler that just got their feelings hurt, with Creighton being your mommy and Evansville being your sister.

You are ignorant, arrogant and annoying. I am embarrassed to be associated with you as a fan.

+1 Dude (Rox) - Chill.

[AndShock]

Slight change of subject, but a great nugget from BEARZ a year ago:

I'd bet a beer or two in St. Louis 4 years from now, that the names Thurman and Marshall will have caused much more opponent angst than Baker and Van Fleet.

Obviously, not a homer, and a wealth of knowledge. Also a post Wufan would agree with.

I'm a homer but looking at it objectively bearz statement isn't outlandish at all.

So far Baker looks like a total stud but that's based on just a half season or less. Marshal was just as impressive, was FOY and proved his worth over a whole season. Given Bakers performance in the tournament I'd rate that one even. Van fleet was good but was pretty up and down as the backup PG. Thurman had an up and down season too with several very good games. Van fleet was probably more consistent IMO so slight advantage there. Both players have a ton of upside/potential. Actually all 4 do.

So overall after one year slight advantage to WSU's guys. But Bearz was talking after 4 years. IMO all 4 are (or will be) very good MVC players. Who knows which duo ends up being better? It could easily go either way.

I think it depends on how you define "opponent angst." I'm not going to care much if Thurman and Marshall average 25 ppg each but go 0-10 against WSU in their 4 years. If Marshall and Thurman can't win at SWOMO then it doesn't matter how good they are as individuals. Baker and FVV on the other hand are already responsible for beating Gonzaga and sparking a Final Four run.

Side note: I decided to look up Missouri State's schedule and the first result still says "Southwest Missouri." Funny stuff.

[glm38]

Then you are talking team results not individual players. And I seriously doubt we go winless against WSU over their 4 years. I do know I saw a look of "angst" on G Marshall 's face as he was trying multiple defenders on Marcus in St. Louis. You won the game though and had the great run in the tournament - kudos for that. But that has nothing.to do with the statement in question.

[shoxrox]

I'm a homer but looking at it objectively bearz statement isn't outlandish at all.

So far Baker looks like a total stud but that's based on just a half season or less. Marshal was just as impressive, was FOY and proved his worth over a whole season. Given Bakers performance in the tournament I'd rate that one even. Van fleet was good but was pretty up and down as the backup PG. Thurman had an up and down season too with several very good games. Van fleet was probably more consistent IMO so slight advantage there. Both players have a ton of upside/potential. Actually all 4 do.

So overall after one year slight advantage to WSU's guys. But Bearz was talking after 4 years. IMO all 4 are (or will be) very good MVC players. Who knows which duo ends up being better? It could easily go either way.

glm, you know I respect your posts and opinions because you are a good representative of your school, unlike your counterpart, who whined about shots being fired, when he was the one who fired the first shot using terminology such as "butt boys".

I think individually the 4 players are close. It's really unfair for Baker, considering he only played about 1/5 of the season. Scoring lots of points and being good players doesn't mean as much if you're playing on a play-in team. It just doesn't. AndShock made some good points along the lines of these. FVV may not have been a stat filler but he was a huge factor in getting WSU to the Sweet 16, which of course, is a major deal. I think those two have been giving opponents more angst, opponents such as Aaron Craft and Kevin Pangos, than some of the opponents MSU slipped past last year, which was few and far between. Not to mention the fact that FVV and Baker both have 3-0 scoreboard on Marshall/Thurman thus far. And I obviously respect both MSU players who have tremendous upside and will probably be garnering their share of rewards when it's all said and done, but as of right now, I would think MSU would need to make the NCAA's within the next 3 years, much less make it to a Sweet 16 or Final 4 to carry the additional weight to give them an edge and I dunno if I see that happening.

[glm38]

Fair points. As you said though the 4 players are close in talent at this point. The rest just depends on whether.you are terming the original statement from an individual or a team success point of view.

I'll disagree on the Bears making the NCAA's. Probably a long shot this year but I think it happens before Marshal and Thurman graduate.