MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby smidge34 » December 24th, 2021, 10:06 am

2025 is 3 years away, who knows what will happen? If you do can I borrow your crystal ball before the Powerball drawing? :roll: Besides, I don’t believe for one second the MVC is gonna tell us to hang out til 2025, just somebody on a message board throwing blind darts.
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby BCPanther » December 24th, 2021, 10:35 am

smidge34 wrote:2025 is 3 years away, who knows what will happen? If you do can I borrow your crystal ball before the Powerball drawing? :roll: Besides, I don’t believe for one second the MVC is gonna tell us to hang out til 2025, just somebody on a message board throwing blind darts.


Figure out what to do with football and, yeah, come on in next year. All I'm saying is that the earliest football could come into the MVFC, the same timeline that UND came in on.
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby Chuck_A » December 24th, 2021, 2:43 pm

BCPanther wrote:
My gut says Arlington only for next year since they don't have any exit fee issues. The Sun Belt is more than happy to wish them well in their new endeavors since they don't play football.

UIC in 23-24 and Murray in 24-25. Murray could be sooner if they can find a non-MVFC home. The 2024 season is the earliest they could get in the MVFC from a scheduling perspective and iron out how scheduling is going to work that doesn't completely screw UNI and Missouri State.

Also gives you two full years for whoever #14 is to show that they should be #14.


At this point, with the realignment/expansion landscape blowing up and with another possible round in '25, the MVC feels that now is the time to solidify itself against poachers and defectors alike athletically. More importantly though, as has been talked about, it's about the survival of some of the Valley Universities. Don't really need to rehash the 360 degree video about the importance of large and/or growing markets (Chicago, Arlington, Kansas City) or Frank the Tank's take on "think like a President". My gut feeling is The Valley will add 2- Murray State and UIC. Since the Presidents are after regular students moreso than the student-athlete and are enamoured with UTA, They just might go ahead and take it to the hilt and add all four. However many they add, I don't believe they'll be phased in. Why? If Murray isn't extended an invite this time around, they could very well be in the SoCon or ASUN and not willing to leave if The Valley comes calling again. Continually being left at the altar can cause irreparable damage!
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby Greg » December 27th, 2021, 3:16 pm

I would like to share an excellent post from Big D on the UIC message board :

With Murray St, I feel like it’s WYSIWYG. You know you’re going to get a solid basketball program with solid history. But how much room is there for growth? Inviting them would be adding them at their “peak”…which isn’t a bad thing, because, again, you know what you’re getting…it’s basically the sole reason the MVC wants them.

But the MVC has to see the potential in UIC. If you add UIC now, it’s closer to its floor than its ceiling. We have underachieved tremendously in basketball. That is indisputable. We have also underachieved in baseball the last decade given our history and the ridiculous facilities we have. We are down from the glory days in soccer. Only recently have we started winning again in softball and tennis. We also just went to our first volleyball NCAA tourney. I think we have a higher athletic ceiling than Murray. And it’s not even worth comparing location, academics, etc. Will we ever get to where we want to go? Not sure. It’s not like we don’t spend money. We do. But a new conference could be the shot in the arm we need. I’m biased, but UIC is a risk the MVC has to take.
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby Murraygrad05 » December 27th, 2021, 9:20 pm

Greg wrote:I would like to share an excellent post from Big D on the UIC message board :

With Murray St, I feel like it’s WYSIWYG. You know you’re going to get a solid basketball program with solid history. But how much room is there for growth? Inviting them would be adding them at their “peak”…which isn’t a bad thing, because, again, you know what you’re getting…it’s basically the sole reason the MVC wants them.

But the MVC has to see the potential in UIC. If you add UIC now, it’s closer to its floor than its ceiling. We have underachieved tremendously in basketball. That is indisputable. We have also underachieved in baseball the last decade given our history and the ridiculous facilities we have. We are down from the glory days in soccer. Only recently have we started winning again in softball and tennis. We also just went to our first volleyball NCAA tourney. I think we have a higher athletic ceiling than Murray. And it’s not even worth comparing location, academics, etc. Will we ever get to where we want to go? Not sure. It’s not like we don’t spend money. We do. But a new conference could be the shot in the arm we need. I’m biased, but UIC is a risk the MVC has to take.


“At our peak…” Good lord man do some research. I guess our “peak” is 30+ years of sustained success, 43rd all time in wins among NCAA teams, and a perennial tourney team?

Yep you caught us at our peak.

I can’t believe a conference would want (or not want it seems in our case) to add a team that is already solidly set up to compete and improve the overall state. :roll:
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby MissouriValleyUnite » December 27th, 2021, 9:34 pm

Yeah, between the emphasis on non-revenue sports and the emphasis on “at their peak”, that post is off.

Adding someone “at their peak” would be adding George Mason after their Final Four run or adding UMBC after they upset Virginia.

If a program’s a consistent winner for 35+ years, they’re not at their peak. They’re at their norm.

Adding UIC for potential (their MBB budget is identical to Loyola’s entering the MVC, inflation-adjusted) tracks, but the Murray/peak analogy is off the mark.
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby IllinoisState » December 27th, 2021, 9:46 pm

Plus Loyola is a private school with more money so it's easier to pour money into programs.
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby valleydays » December 27th, 2021, 9:53 pm

Yeah, that "peak" post was pretty funny. Many of us old-timers thought Racer basketball peaked about a decade ago, when it won 31 games in a season including a win in the NCAA Tournament.

Then two years later, they again won 31 games, including another win in the NCAA Tournament. Both of those teams had a guard named Isaiah Canaan, Many of us thought it would be several years before Murray got another future NBA point guard.

It took two years.

A team given up for lost mid-season got hot and won a postseason invitational tournament, and the next year made the NIT quarterfinals before getting beat on a half-court shot on the road. Those teams had a current NBA point guard named Cameron Payne.

Well, some of us thought Murray State would never be able to do better than Canaan or Payne. Then Ja Morant enrolled, and Murray State again advanced in the NCAA Tournament. Morant is now getting votes for the NBA All-Star team. (Oh, and that Racer team had another current NBA player, Shaq Buchanan.)

So, yeah, that's just the last 10 years. Before that, 20-win seasons and conference championships were the norm. Knowledgeable fans already know Murray State's basketball history. Pretty safe bet it hasn't "peaked" yet.

But, yeah, sure, go with a school with no track record. The possibilities!

As for me, I'd like to see the Valley invite BOTH Murray State and UIC ... NOW! Just like I was in favor of adding Valpo and Murray State a few years ago.

It's time to add the Racers to the MVC. Don't blow it, presidents. As another poster said, if you have to come calling a third time, there may be no answer.
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby SalukiWorld » December 27th, 2021, 10:30 pm

Guessing the Valley invites UIC and UT Arlington and sticks at 12
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Re: MVC Expansion Candidate Deep Dive

Postby Murraygrad05 » December 27th, 2021, 10:47 pm

SalukiWorld wrote:Guessing the Valley invites UIC and UT Arlington and sticks at 12


If that’s the case then good luck. Welcome to the new OVC.

Those add absolutely nothing of worth.
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