Report: Horizon League has extended an offer to Murray State

[RacerJoeD]

Summit is more stable than the WAC. If IUPUI and FW both end up in the horizon (a good move as they both fit), look for the summit to raid the WAC and the WAC fall apart.

[uniftw]

Summit is more stable than the WAC. If IUPUI and FW both end up in the horizon (a good move as they both fit), look for the summit to raid the WAC and the WAC fall apart.

The Summit is not more stable the WAC - especially if IPFW gets an invite for next year. The Summit is then down to 5 baseball members.

The WAC and Summit would be smart to merge and form two geogrpahic divisions. This would mean IUPUI, IPFW and WIU take off to the Horizon/OVC but it creates a real nice 16 team divisional conference.

WIU has been in the Summit forever, but if that footprint keeps growing like it's going to have too they aren't sticking around - especially when the Indiana's leave.

NDSU will never get into the MWC. They are happy at 11, and if they add a 12 it will be after the B12 implodes in a few years when KU and OU end up in the B10 and the rest split between the PAC 12, SEC, AAC and MWC. That is all significantly more likely than NDSU in the MWC.

Make fun of a bus league all you want, the reality is by being able to send teams on a 4 hour bus trip we can have basketball budgets where we do rather than having to keep them at 1.3-1.4m because we having to fly our teams halfway across the country to play on a Tuesday night.

[uniguy]

Getting UMKC back in the Summit makes sense to replace iupui, but they don't have baseball. Chicago State has baseball, but is always in immediate danger of closing so theres that.

[Make MVC Great Again]

Robert Morris was a candidate for the Horizon League.

Crazy to think a league could potentially stretch from Pennsylvania to New Mexico.

[VUGrad1314]

Guys, you gotta get over Belmont. They're tapped out. They have no desire to move up. None. Look elsewhere.

When you say "tapped out" do you mean financially? because I think a confluence of several factors could really help change their thinking:

1. The OVC's media deal I have heard is up for renegotiation soon. With money drying up in the media the new terms may mean a smaller piece of the pie for all members

2. APR is about to mean additional money for qualifying schools. Belmont's scores are very good and would qualify under the new system . This could help offset realignment and travel cost increases.

3. Under a 12 (or more ) team setup, the MVC would go to divisional play greatly reducing Belmont's travel burden. This changes the calculus significantly as the increase in competition, profile and media exposure along with the prospect of joining a multi-bid league could make the relatively modest increase in travel cost worthwhile. I think a lot of people are assuming based on Belmont's past actions that they'd say no.What they're missing is the potential game changer that divisional play is. Belmont has only said no to the 10 team round robin MVC setup. This divisional setup has never been offered to them because twelve teams and divisional play is only just now being discussed and put on the table. Similarly the OVC's move away from divisions will bring Belmont's travel budget more in line with what it would be under the MVC division proposal, further increasing the possibility that Belmont will agree to make the jump. Only one potential divisional opponent (Missouri State)is further away than all of their OVC opponents and every non-divisional road game except the Iowa schools is within 30 minutes travel time distance. More on this in point 4.

4. Realignment, which appears certain to affect OVC teams soon, could cause Belmont to doubt the stability of the league or threaten further diminishing of its profile such that a conference tournament title means the play in game and a regular season title means an NIT 8 seed AKA guaranteed losses that do little to enhance the school's brand and image SIUE Murray State Morehead State and others have been discussed to one degree or another as potentialities for other conferences and Eastern Kentucky and Jacksonville State are rumored to want to go FBS. Additionally, another far-flung team like Western Illinois could move to the OVC if both Indiana schools leave the Summit. Travel to that road game would be further than all MVC opponents except the Iowa schools and they wouldn't even have to make the trip out there every year like they would to Western Illinois. At that point it becomes a game of would you rather:

SIU or SEMO?

Valpo\Loyola or WIU?

ISUb or Morehead St.?

Why settle for a game against EIU when just one hour and change further sets up a marquee mid major matchup with ISUr? Just 30 minutes beyond that is Bradley

Why play SIUE when less than two hours' additional travel Maybe an extra tank of gas round trip allows you to play a really strong Missouri State team?

AND you get to keep your rivalry with Murray

Is Belmont really so cash strapped that they can't afford a few extra tanks of gas per year for all sports?

Is Belmont really short-sighted enough to cling to those RPI sinks surrounding them in Tennessee just because they're close by and easy to beat?

Surely not.

[RacerJoeD]

Financially no, but more so from a desire standpoint. I don't think they have administration that desires a continuous move up. Otherwise they would have leapt at the MVC the first time (or the second for that matter). They know that as of now their success is owed to one guy- Rick Byrd. And make nommistake, he is a Hall of Fame caliber coach. But he won't be there forever and they want to be in a position where success isn't fleeting when he goes.

[uniftw]

The fact remains that outside of Murray State, the rest of who we could grab is likely going to suck balls in about 90 different ways.

As much as I, and I do as much/more than anyone else, bang on the Dakota's for not being MVC schools I think we are at a point where they are the best/next logical step.

NDSU's new arena is nothing but a multipurpose room with seats, but it's better than the Knapp and they own it - so a handful of teams don't have that. Chances are their attendance won't go up much, but we are looking at places like Belmont for a 12th - which actually has a smaller capacity than NDSU's place.

Is football going to being king, by a long shot, up there? Sure. Do they need to double (minimum) their budget to make the rest of us start to feel better? Absolutely. If there's one thing NDSU has is a fan base with money and no where else to spend it other than NDSU athletics. I know we don't really care about other sports as much as basketball, but they have a pretty solid T&F program, solid softball and baseball programs as well.

SDSU's renovation to Frost arena would make it one of the best arenas in the MVC. School owned, larger capacity, and the entire campus has been/will be rebuilt over the last 7 years and into the next 4. On top of their new football facility (which none of you care about) they built an indoor track facility that is at/near the top of the MVC. SDSU is also a basketball first school, and has been always been. The women's team is a top 25 caliber team as well.

Both schools offer every single mens sport - sans soccer - and womens sport and share a conference with the football schools (and UNI in wrestling - where NDSU and SDSU are top 25 programs...like UNI)

Murray State is the only option that is as good/better than them all around. The fact remains there isn't a private school out there that can touch what those two have/are accomplishing across an entire athletic department. Those two schools would probably dominate the Horizon, just as Valpo has the last 6 years. Those two would most definitely dominate the OVC as Murray and Belmont have.


I'd like to have Murray State as well, but the reality is that if we are going to add, it will be in pairs. Find a realistic 12th (meaning NOT Dayton, SLU, Marquette, etc...) to put with Murray State and compare the two combined resumes against the combined resume of the DSUs. Maybe UT-A or UALR comes close, I don't know enough about their secondary sports.

I know the reality is that the school presidents will never go for the Dakotas, because they are public and have football. However, it's getting to the point that if we actually start looking at total athletic departments, athletic department ceiling, spending, potential, etc... we see that the Dakota's aren't as far off of where we need our 11th and 12th to be.

[Redhawk]

The fact remains that outside of Murray State, the rest of who we could grab is likely going to suck balls in about 90 different ways.

As much as I, and I do as much/more than anyone else, bang on the Dakota's for not being MVC schools I think we are at a point where they are the best/next logical step.

NDSU's new arena is nothing but a multipurpose room with seats, but it's better than the Knapp and they own it - so a handful of teams don't have that. Chances are their attendance won't go up much, but we are looking at places like Belmont for a 12th - which actually has a smaller capacity than NDSU's place.

Is football going to being king, by a long shot, up there? Sure. Do they need to double (minimum) their budget to make the rest of us start to feel better? Absolutely. If there's one thing NDSU has is a fan base with money and no where else to spend it other than NDSU athletics. I know we don't really care about other sports as much as basketball, but they have a pretty solid T&F program, solid softball and baseball programs as well.

SDSU's renovation to Frost arena would make it one of the best arenas in the MVC. School owned, larger capacity, and the entire campus has been/will be rebuilt over the last 7 years and into the next 4. On top of their new football facility (which none of you care about) they built an indoor track facility that is at/near the top of the MVC. SDSU is also a basketball first school, and has been always been. The women's team is a top 25 caliber team as well.

Both schools offer every single mens sport - sans soccer - and womens sport and share a conference with the football schools (and UNI in wrestling - where NDSU and SDSU are top 25 programs...like UNI)

Murray State is the only option that is as good/better than them all around. The fact remains there isn't a private school out there that can touch what those two have/are accomplishing across an entire athletic department. Those two schools would probably dominate the Horizon, just as Valpo has the last 6 years. Those two would most definitely dominate the OVC as Murray and Belmont have.


I'd like to have Murray State as well, but the reality is that if we are going to add, it will be in pairs. Find a realistic 12th (meaning Dayton, SLU, Marquette, etc...) to put with Murray State and compare the two combined resumes against the combined resume of the DSUs. Maybe UT-A or UALR comes close, I don't know enough about their secondary sports.

I know the reality is that the school presidents will never go for the Dakotas, because they are public and have football. However, it's getting to the point that if we actually start looking at total athletic departments, athletic department ceiling, spending, potential, etc... we see that the Dakota's aren't as far off of where we need our 11th and 12th to be.

Totally agree with you on the 11th and 12th options! I don't have anything against Murray St but am not real high on Belmont. The long term prospects of those two in the Valley trend towards ISUb and Evansville respectfully. The conference has to do better than that! NDSU and SDSU have the resources to compete in all sports and would most likely up the ante in basketball to match the upgrade in competition.

[VUGrad1314]

Not opposed to the Dakotas as options at all. In fact I believe that they could do a great deal for the competitiveness of the conference across the board. My one concern would be that their addition may increase the likelihood that the conference breaks apart one day because of various schools' FBS aspirations.

[VUGrad1314]

Financially no, but more so from a desire standpoint. I don't think they have administration that desires a continuous move up. Otherwise they would have leapt at the MVC the first time (or the second for that matter). They know that as of now their success is owed to one guy- Rick Byrd. And make nommistake, he is a Hall of Fame caliber coach. But he won't be there forever and they want to be in a position where success isn't fleeting when he goes.

Again, there's a big difference in cost between the round robin MVC which has been pitched to and declined twice by Belmont and the divisions based MVC, which Belmont would be joining this go-round especially with the OVC abandoning divisional play. As for future coaching searches wouldn't it be easier to attract and keep the next Rick Byrd in the MVC as opposed to the OVC? Belmont has to think strategically like this lest it run the risk of falling off the top of the one-bid OVC and make the success they now enjoy a distant memory. I think you'd be surprised by the answer out of Nashville this time.