If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

[BEARZ77]

We'll stay at 10 if the decision makers don't think it will help getting multiple bids. It's really that simple.

Well again, conferences don't get bids teams do. Conferences can only aid the process by having easily accessible top level wins built into their conference schedules via H/H games against each other. We will never have that luxury, so if that means staying at 10, then we do I guess cause there is nobody out there who can get us multiple bids. But lets be honest, none of our parent schools would either if they were the schools looking to join. Again we'll have some opportunities for multiple bids, but it will be based solely on the strength of individual schedules and wins in the non-con, not the conference.

[rally]

We'll stay at 10 if the decision makers don't think it will help getting multiple bids. It's really that simple.

Well again, conferences don't get bids teams do. Conferences can only aid the process by having easily accessible top level wins built into their conference schedules via H/H games against each other. We will never have that luxury, so if that means staying at 10, then we do I guess cause there is nobody out there who can get us multiple bids. But lets be honest, none of our parent schools would either if they were the schools looking to join. Again we'll have some opportunities for multiple bids, but it will be based solely on the strength of individual schedules and wins in the non-con, not the conference.

And if you add programs that are capable of getting at large bids, the greater the chance you will have getting multiple bids. Just need to hit in the non-conference.

This was a 2 bid conference in 2015 and 2016. Heck, if ISUr doesn't blow an 18 point lead in 2015, it would have been a 3 bid conference. Losing WSU hurts, but way too much doom and gloom about ISUr not getting a bid.

[mvfcfan]

Potential. As mentioned before, NKU has great facilities and is located in hotbed for college hoops. Making the NCAA tourney in their first year eligible isn't what draws me to them, but it does make me a little more optimistic on reaching their potential. But that's really it.

The Valley really doesn't have any great options. If we expand past 10, you want someone who can elevate the conference, not just blend in. Most of the schools listed have just been mediocre and I don't expect that to all of sudden just change. ORU has been to 5 NCAA tournaments in 40+ years as a D1 program. I really don't see them doing much more than blending in. At this level, expansion is all about men's basketball and getting multiple bids. That's where the money can be made. Success in non-revenue sports matter very little, if at all.

Currently, I only see Murray State as someone worth expanding the conference. I'd take them as a #11 team and call it a day. But if you want to pick #12 today, I picking a program with upside and right now that would be NKU.

Not saying I disagree with NKU's potential, but I find it extremely questionable. If you were to drop Northern Kentucky in the MVC today with Murray State they would rank 12th on their budget and they would rank 11th in attendance. If you were to drop Oral Roberts in the conference today with Murray State, ORU would rank 5th on their budget and they would rank 9th in attendance. In fact ORU ranks ahead of Murray State in both categories. Oral Roberts may be down right now, but they're definitely spending more money on basketball and they definitely have a larger fan base than NKU.

[uniftw]

Not saying I disagree with NKU's potential, but I find it extremely questionable. If you were to drop Northern Kentucky in the MVC today with Murray State they would rank 12th on their budget and they would rank 11th in attendance. If you were to drop Oral Roberts in the conference today with Murray State, ORU would rank 5th on their budget and they would rank 9th in attendance. In fact ORU ranks ahead of Murray State in both categories. Oral Roberts may be down right now, but they're definitely spending more money on basketball and they definitely have a larger fan base than NKU.

Bradley is first in MVC basketball budgets
Evansville third
Loyola 4th
Valpo 5th
Drake 6th

UNI is the only public school in the top half of spending - 2nd

Each schools average finish since Loyola joined the league
Illinois State - 2.5
Northern IA - 3
Indiana State- 5
Southern IL - 5
Evansville - 5.75
Missouri St - 6
Loyola - 7.25
Bradley - 8
Drake - 8.5

Spending clearly isn't equaling results.

ORU is a freaking dumpster fire in the Summit and that's outspending everyone, except Denver. That's with them literally doubling (at least) everyone in the conference in budget except Denver and IUPUI....who is no longer there.

[rally]

Potential. As mentioned before, NKU has great facilities and is located in hotbed for college hoops. Making the NCAA tourney in their first year eligible isn't what draws me to them, but it does make me a little more optimistic on reaching their potential. But that's really it.

The Valley really doesn't have any great options. If we expand past 10, you want someone who can elevate the conference, not just blend in. Most of the schools listed have just been mediocre and I don't expect that to all of sudden just change. ORU has been to 5 NCAA tournaments in 40+ years as a D1 program. I really don't see them doing much more than blending in. At this level, expansion is all about men's basketball and getting multiple bids. That's where the money can be made. Success in non-revenue sports matter very little, if at all.

Currently, I only see Murray State as someone worth expanding the conference. I'd take them as a #11 team and call it a day. But if you want to pick #12 today, I picking a program with upside and right now that would be NKU.

Not saying I disagree with NKU's potential, but I find it extremely questionable. If you were to drop Northern Kentucky in the MVC today with Murray State they would rank 12th on their budget and they would rank 11th in attendance. If you were to drop Oral Roberts in the conference today with Murray State, ORU would rank 5th on their budget and they would rank 9th in attendance. In fact ORU ranks ahead of Murray State in both categories. Oral Roberts may be down right now, but they're definitely spending more money on basketball and they definitely have a larger fan base than NKU.

ORU's attendance dropped for the 5th consecutive year to 2,827.
NKU's attendance increased for the 3rd straight year to 2,824.

ORU has to spend more on travel. The closest school to them is about the same distance as farthest school from NKU in the Horizon. Same with Murray in the OVC. The Horizon and OVC are essentially bus leagues. I'm interested to see how NKU's spending stacks up now that they are fully D1 and eligible for NCAA tourney.

There still a lot of unknowns about NKU, so I can understand there is going by some difference in opinion on their potential. I don't think the MVC is in hurry to go to 12, so there will be time to evaluate them.

[Redbirds4Life]

Of the teams that would actually come....

UW-Milwaukee

and

Belmont

*I will take the teams from the bigger cities.

[RacerJoeD]

Of the teams that would actually come....

UW-Milwaukee

and

Belmont

*I will take the teams from the bigger cities.

I don't think I understand

[MissouriValleyUnite]

I will take the teams that win.

29 consecutive winning seasons
2 NCAA Tourney wins this decade
2 regular season top 25 finishes this decade

In the coulda, woulda, shoulda category...
A point away from being the first 16 to knock off a 1 (Michigan St - lost in OT)
Kansas' toughest game (3 pts) en route to winning '88 national title
Butler's toughest game (2 pts) en route to '10 national title game

We could be talking about a Murray State program today with a final 4 run under its belt if they landed in another bracket in '88 or '10.

You guys talk about needing programs who help the conference contend for at-large bids? You got it. They've sustained that in the OVC for 30 years.

Also let me know if a non-mvc midwestern mid-major has contended for an at-large this decade. 2012 Oral Roberts had one sewn up until St Bonavenuture upset a ranked Xavier right before the selection show.

[Redbirds4Life]

Of the teams that would actually come....

UW-Milwaukee

and

Belmont

*I will take the teams from the bigger cities.

I don't think I understand

My point is to take the teams from the bigger cities. Nashville and Milwaukee. I'm sure most of you have an argument around Oral Roberts, or Murray State being better options. There are plenty of programs who have had success and made the tourney and won games, etc, but I would be more interested in expanding the reach of your league to new markets.

Realistically, it doesn't matter all that much, there are no game changers out there. Losing Creighton knocked the league down a peg and losing Wichita State, knocked it down another. The Valley is a long way from getting back to what it once was. I hope it does one day, but I don't see that coming any time soon.

[RacerJoeD]

So program stability and success is less important than City size? So preferentially go for teams like St Peter's Peacocks, Fordham Rams or Chicago State? Or like Omaha or UMKC?