Belmont to Missouri Valley

[VUGrad1314]

How many at large bids have the rest of the MVC teams received in the last decade?

How many at large bids has Murray EVER received? How many times has Murray EVER made it past the 2nd round? That 30 or so point A kicking that FL State put on y’all when you had your greatest player EVER did not move the needle much. At some point you have to walk the walk.

All time tournament wins:

Loyola 15

Bradley 11

SIU 6

Drake 6

UNI 5

Indiana State 5

Murray State 4

Missouri State 3

Illinois State 3

Valparaiso 2

Evansville 1

Belmont 1


Maybe Murray State doesn't have the deep tournament runs but they have more tournament wins than half of the conference and just two less than anyone but the top two.

All time tournament appearances:

Murray State 17

SIU 10

Bradley 9

Valpo 9

UNI 8

Belmont 8

Loyola 7

Missouri State 6

Illinois State 6

Evansville 5

Drake 5

Indiana State 4



Yes I know they have done it by dominating a weaker league but they still have more tournament appearances than ANY MVC member. They may not make deep runs but they get there and when they get there they win with good frequency. They are absolutely an addition that moves the needle. Even a second round appearance brings two units to the conference which is very valuable. Murray State also has not one but TWO lottery picks in the NBA Draft since 2015 and has had (I believe) 2 top 25 finishes in that span. They are absolutely an add that moves the needle for the conference.

[Dawgbit]

How many at large bids have the rest of the MVC teams received in the last decade?

How many at large bids has Murray EVER received? How many times has Murray EVER made it past the 2nd round? That 30 or so point A kicking that FL State put on y’all when you had your greatest player EVER did not move the needle much. At some point you have to walk the walk.

All time tournament wins:

Loyola 15

Bradley 11

SIU 6

Drake 6

UNI 5

Indiana State 5

Murray State 4

Missouri State 3

Illinois State 3

Valparaiso 2

Evansville 1

Belmont 1


Maybe Murray State doesn't have the deep tournament runs but they have more tournament wins than half of the conference and just two less than anyone but the top two.

All time tournament appearances:

Murray State 17

SIU 10

Bradley 9

Valpo 9

UNI 8

Belmont 8

Loyola 7

Missouri State 6

Illinois State 6

Evansville 5

Drake 5

Indiana State 4



Yes I know they have done it by dominating a weaker league but they still have more tournament appearances than ANY MVC member. They may not make deep runs but they get there and when they get there they win with good frequency. They are absolutely an addition that moves the needle. Even a second round appearance brings two units to the conference which is very valuable. Murray State also has not one but TWO lottery picks in the NBA Draft since 2015 and has had (I believe) 2 top 25 finishes in that span. They are absolutely an add that moves the needle for the conference.

Nice work. How about looking at win percentages. Kinda weeds out the big fish in the small pond, which is getting smaller by the minute LOL.

[RacerJoeD]

Also shows the value of seeding…

[Dawgbit]

Also shows the value of seeding…

Excuses are made for those who need them. You don’t think the MVC gets screwed on seeding? When Loyola went the FF three years ago, they would not have made Dance had they not won MVC tournament. You gotta walk the walk, if you can.

[VUGrad1314]

How many at large bids has Murray EVER received? How many times has Murray EVER made it past the 2nd round? That 30 or so point A kicking that FL State put on y’all when you had your greatest player EVER did not move the needle much. At some point you have to walk the walk.

All time tournament wins:

Loyola 15

Bradley 11

SIU 6

Drake 6

UNI 5

Indiana State 5

Murray State 4

Missouri State 3

Illinois State 3

Valparaiso 2

Evansville 1

Belmont 1


Maybe Murray State doesn't have the deep tournament runs but they have more tournament wins than half of the conference and just two less than anyone but the top two.

All time tournament appearances:

Murray State 17

SIU 10

Bradley 9

Valpo 9

UNI 8

Belmont 8

Loyola 7

Missouri State 6

Illinois State 6

Evansville 5

Drake 5

Indiana State 4



Yes I know they have done it by dominating a weaker league but they still have more tournament appearances than ANY MVC member. They may not make deep runs but they get there and when they get there they win with good frequency. They are absolutely an addition that moves the needle. Even a second round appearance brings two units to the conference which is very valuable. Murray State also has not one but TWO lottery picks in the NBA Draft since 2015 and has had (I believe) 2 top 25 finishes in that span. They are absolutely an add that moves the needle for the conference.

Nice work. How about looking at win percentages. Kinda weeds out the big fish in the small pond, which is getting smaller by the minute LOL.

There's a hole in this line of thinking though: joining the MVC will allow Murray State to recruit even better players build deeper teams earn higher seeds if they can get into the tournament and therefore increase their odds of increasing their winning percentage. They won't make it as often but they will get higher seeds which will give them more of a chance to win. All but two of their appearances have been as a 12 seed or lower. Just this past year we saw MVC teams get an 8 and an 11. Making the conference stronger and deeper should make those numbers go up.

Anyway I know would've could've should've but Murray State also boasts the following marks:

1988 Lost by 3 to Kansas who went on to win the National Title

1990: Lost by 4 in Overtime to Michigan State who made the Sweet 16

1997: Lost by 3 to Duke who lost in the next round

2006: Lost by 4 to North Carolina who lost in the next round

2010: Lost by 2 to Butler who made the Title Game

If Murray State had gotten a few bounces to go their way in just three games they could have 3 Sweet 16s and 2 Final Fours on their resume. I know any team can say this but I think you're being overly reductionist to say that the fact that they've never made a run or that their winning percentage is low in the tournament is some kind of knock against them.

And for the record these are the teams below .500 in the NCAA Tournament all time

Murray State SIU Valpo Belmont Evansville Missouri State Illinois State UNI In fact only Bradley Drake Indiana State and Loyola are over .500 all time in the tournament. That's not a good barometer for whether a team is worthy of inclusion in the MVC either.

[msu]

How many at large bids have the rest of the MVC teams received in the last decade?

How many at large bids has Murray EVER received? How many times has Murray EVER made it past the 2nd round? That 30 or so point A kicking that FL State put on y’all when you had your greatest player EVER did not move the needle much. At some point you have to walk the walk.

MURRAY STATE SINCE 2010:
-Four NCAA appearances (13 seed in 2010, 6 seed in 2012, 12 seed in 2018 and 2019)
-Advanced in three of those four appearances (one of which was a thorough demolition of Marquette in 2019)
-One basket away from Sweet 16 in 2010, extremely close again in 2012
-Two seasons ranked in AP Top 25 (one of those seasons was actually AP Top 10)
-Two NBA Draft lottery picks (one went on to become the NBA rookie of the year)
-Another early 2nd round NBA draft pick
-Last undefeated team in America in 2012 at 23-0
-Seven OVC regular season championships

need I continue? Belmont is an extremely solid add. They are our chief rival, but I respect their program immensely. They have had much success and have, along with Murray, dominated the OVC for the past decade. The two programs have pushed each other to be better, and it's been a fun (and sometimes heartbreaking) rivalry. You say we have never made it past the 2nd round. Well, Belmont has never even made it *to* the second round--Something we've done three times in the past decade. Their one tourney win ever was a play-in game. They've also never been ranked in the top 25 or produced a lottery pick. They have a great, GREAT program. But Murray is just as good. And in terms of history and prolonged success, I'd put the Racers ahead of them.

I've also seen a few comments saying that men's basketball is the only decent sport at the school. Not true. Our soccer and volleyball programs are extremely solid. Our football team has historically struggled, yes, but we seem to have turned a corner in the past year or so. We were picked to win the league this year. Our rifle program (I know, not an MVC sport) wins NCAA championships. Our women's basketball team is also on the rise.

Bottom line, I think it's insulting for a program as proud as Murray to possibly be stuck in an extremely depleted OVC. We see a great basketball league, we know what we bring to the table, and we want in.

[jsaluki080]

How many at large bids have the rest of the MVC teams received in the last decade?

How many at large bids has Murray EVER received? How many times has Murray EVER made it past the 2nd round? That 30 or so point A kicking that FL State put on y’all when you had your greatest player EVER did not move the needle much. At some point you have to walk the walk.

In fairness, does anybody remember how often Creighton made the NCAA tournament yet they never even reached the sweet 16.

But they were consistently upper echelon with solid rpi and had a large fan base that traveled. .. so a highly valued member

[All-MVC Fan]

Guys, it’s pretty damned hard to argue that Murray wouldn’t be a great add to the MVC. So take a step back and realize it would be a good thing. Murray has the recent success, and has shown they can sustain the success through coaching changes, administration changes, anything the NCAA can throw at a mid-major. They’ve been chugging along for 30+ years. We should demand the university presidents invite them, not sit at our keyboards debating whether they’re worthy. They’re most certainly worthy.

[VUGrad1314]

If you're not excited about Belmont's addition you should be. This video shows why. It also lays out the expansion possibilities for the MVC and lists reasons for and against the candidates. It makes a REALLY strong case for Murray State UIC NKU and for UT-Arlington for that matter though I still don't want them until they show a pulse in basketball.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3en4npeWKZ4

Belmont was the University presidents' add that happens to be a good basketball add. Give us a basketball add this time. They may not be the best of the candidates academically but they will bring money and attention to this league and elevate their profile. I've beat this drum for four years I won't stop now: Add Murray State.

[mvfcfan]

I've been an Indiana State fan my entire life and I really do enjoy MVC basketball. What I don't enjoy is the political BS when it comes to expansion. This whole debate between private vs public, FB vs no football, academics aren't good enough, market isn't good enough, etc is getting really old. The conference should be adding strong basketball schools that are in the region regardless of if they are private, public, or whether or not they have football.

Last I checked the MVC is an athletic conference. Obviously if their academics completely suck and their teams are getting put on probation for low APU scores (see SWAC and MEAC) then yeah that's an issue. Murray State is far from being in any of those categories. Based on what I've read their academics are actually very similar to most of the league's. The presidents, most of whom probably won't even be at their current job 5-10 years from now, need to quit with their BS for the good of the league and for the fans that want to see quality basketball. Enough is enough. If anything the nonsense is holding the MVC back.

Everyone keeps pointing to Loyola as some experiment that went well. Loyola was a good add who had a ton of potential and they also had a lot of basketball history, including a national title.

Valpo and Belmont are both good adds who bring a lot to the table for the sport. And Murray State would also be a great add. We as a conference would be extremely lucky to have all 4 of those schools in the league, along with the 8 that have been here for quite a while to start the 2022 season.