REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby Loyola_Fan » October 27th, 2021, 2:18 pm

BCPanther wrote:
Loyola_Fan wrote:What's the problem with scheduling A 10, MWC, AAC teams? Loyola has Davidson this year, but there's a lot of fluff on our schedule. I get why p6 teams don't want to schedule us, but home and homes with teams from 7, 8, and 9 seem realistic and yet those games seem pretty rare? We actually have more power conference teams scheduled in the non con than good mid major teams this year.


They don't want to go on the road just like we don't want to go on the road.

They don't want to play games that could knock you out of the tournament in Nov/Dec just like we don't want to play games that will knock us out of the tournament in Nov/Dec.

That's how you end up paying Vermont, who's really good, $90,000.


:roll:
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby VUGrad1314 » October 27th, 2021, 2:38 pm

BCPanther wrote:Jake may have said the quiet part out loud at media day today....

'If we look at going to 12, the logical choice is Murray. Now, I mean, I know nothing of that but it just seems logical.'

He wasn't asked specifically about expansion it just came out during a stream of consciousness response talking about scheduling. Also said it's important for the league to get better so that we can stop overpaying for quality buy games and specifically talked about having to spend 'just shy of $150k' on Nicholls and Vermont.


$60K for Nicholls State? Gross. Also sounds like we can glean from that quote that nothing is imminent regarding Murray State and we're probably not even having active discussions with them. That sucks.
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby Sir Sci » October 27th, 2021, 3:14 pm

BEARZ77 wrote:Some of you seem to want to turn this conversation ugly but I'm not sure why. I don't think that will serve any good purpose for the board, but choose your path. Personally I have nothing but good things to say about the Valley overall , and generally hope we stay for the long term; but conference affiliations like many other aspects of collegiate sports are undergoing huge shifts and I certainly won't apologize for MSU trying to look after it's best interests even if I don't always agree with our choices. Unlike WSU , I don't think the majority of Missouri State fans see MSU as being above the Valley, and we wouldn't be moving for that line of thinking.I don't recall seeing any scathing posts from MSU fans about getting out of the Valley and disparaging conference rivals . But some here seem to want to go that way towards MSU and are being disingenuous , because I frequent most team fan boards here and it's a rare board that doesn't have fans speculating or some wishing they could move to a next level league at some point. But like i said, choose your path.


I'm going to echo this. I love the MVC and its culture. I basically come from an MVC family: my grandparents met at SIU, my aunt and uncle met at Evansville, and my brother and I both graduated from Missouri State. I enjoy the rivalries, the history, and the competitiveness of the conference.

At the same time, I'm all in on Missouri State joining an FBS conference, and if C-USA is the conference that's offering that opportunity then I want it to happen. The path forward for Missouri State is to continue raising its profile as a major statewide institution with a national profile. Now, I'm not talking delusions of grandeur like P5 or anything like that (even in the distant future I see that as incredibly unlikely), but the strides we're making are huge: 25k student population, an increasingly engaged alumni base, frequent academic building renovations and construction projects, and probably most importantly the Carnegie classification as a doctoral/professional university.

Like it or not, being an FBS program is an integral part of the profile of major public university. Of course there are exceptions, but this is something that makes a difference in the minds of a lot of people in how they view public colleges. And Missouri is the second populous state without a second FBS school (New Jersey is the biggest, Minnesota being the next biggest after Missouri). The void is there for us to fill, and it'd be foolish for us to not take hold of an opportunity if it presents itself.

Why the rambling? What it comes down to is that Missouri State isn't too good for the MVC at all. The MVC is a great home for Missouri State. But if there are opportunities for growth and pushing forward then we need to take those opportunities. I understand that people can feel slighted when another fanbase wants to move conferences. The "What, are we not good enough for you?" question gets asked. But that's not it at all. Even if we do move conferences I'm still going to love Valley basketball.
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby BCPanther » October 27th, 2021, 3:16 pm

At least you guys have football unlike another former member that joined a football conference....
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby MSUBear42 » October 27th, 2021, 3:28 pm

Sir Sci wrote:
BEARZ77 wrote:Some of you seem to want to turn this conversation ugly but I'm not sure why. I don't think that will serve any good purpose for the board, but choose your path. Personally I have nothing but good things to say about the Valley overall , and generally hope we stay for the long term; but conference affiliations like many other aspects of collegiate sports are undergoing huge shifts and I certainly won't apologize for MSU trying to look after it's best interests even if I don't always agree with our choices. Unlike WSU , I don't think the majority of Missouri State fans see MSU as being above the Valley, and we wouldn't be moving for that line of thinking.I don't recall seeing any scathing posts from MSU fans about getting out of the Valley and disparaging conference rivals . But some here seem to want to go that way towards MSU and are being disingenuous , because I frequent most team fan boards here and it's a rare board that doesn't have fans speculating or some wishing they could move to a next level league at some point. But like i said, choose your path.


I'm going to echo this. I love the MVC and its culture. I basically come from an MVC family: my grandparents met at SIU, my aunt and uncle met at Evansville, and my brother and I both graduated from Missouri State. I enjoy the rivalries, the history, and the competitiveness of the conference.

At the same time, I'm all in on Missouri State joining an FBS conference, and if C-USA is the conference that's offering that opportunity then I want it to happen. The path forward for Missouri State is to continue raising its profile as a major statewide institution with a national profile. Now, I'm not talking delusions of grandeur like P5 or anything like that (even in the distant future I see that as incredibly unlikely), but the strides we're making are huge: 25k student population, an increasingly engaged alumni base, frequent academic building renovations and construction projects, and probably most importantly the Carnegie classification as a doctoral/professional university.

Like it or not, being an FBS program is an integral part of the profile of major public university. Of course there are exceptions, but this is something that makes a difference in the minds of a lot of people in how they view public colleges. And Missouri is the second populous state without a second FBS school (New Jersey is the biggest, Minnesota being the next biggest after Missouri). The void is there for us to fill, and it'd be foolish for us to not take hold of an opportunity if it presents itself.

Why the rambling? What it comes down to is that Missouri State isn't too good for the MVC at all. The MVC is a great home for Missouri State. But if there are opportunities for growth and pushing forward then we need to take those opportunities. I understand that people can feel slighted when another fanbase wants to move conferences. The "What, are we not good enough for you?" question gets asked. But that's not it at all. Even if we do move conferences I'm still going to love Valley basketball.

Well said, Sir!
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby Drakey » October 27th, 2021, 4:36 pm

BCPanther wrote:If anybody is begrudging Missouri State for this, or anybody else that would choose the FBS route, they haven't been paying attention for the last decade and have been living in a hole for the past 3 months.

Football drives the bus. Period. If you can improve your football situation, you improve your departments total financial situation. Full stop. That doesn't even take the positive impact it has on enrollment and research dollars and the entire academic side into account.


Odd. I read an article that as of two years ago the average FBS school lost 8 million more per year than the average FCS school.
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby BEARZ77 » October 27th, 2021, 4:52 pm

Again some seem to overlook that the MVC has changed considerably in membership and focus from who it was when MSU joined. All the western members have left [Tulsa/Creighton/WSU] leaving us on an island by ourselves geographically; every other member has at least 2 if not 3 or more close rivals. Also the last 3 adds have all been privates and with the shrinking of SIU and UNI, the only school even remotely like us as a large state university is Illinois State. Obviously when things get debated and voted on, again we are on an island this time philosophically with most of our constituents. I'm a basketball guy first and as much so for our WBB programs as men's, so I very much am wary of leaving the Valley as it will be hard for MSU to end up in as good a situation if those were the only considerations. I've had to come to grips with football seems our best opportunity to maybe catch a wave in all this realignment madness, so I've changed my focus to just wanting whatever conference we end in to still have decent basketball for the two programs . But again such is all conjecture for now; but I can't fault our administration for taking a stance of preparedness and tire kicking. It's funny about 5-6 years ago A few WSU posters were all making fun of where we were financially and I detailed how they were clueless because we were kicking big dollars into infrastructure, professional degree programs, and student recruitment and that when those things were in place, we would be in a spot to really compete as a University not just in athletics. That remains the goal and like others have noted, we hired a business minded prez with that type of focus . So here we are, we're gonna approach 30,000 students soon, we have great facilities and a beautiful evolving campus, increasing relationships with feeder institutions and collaborative professional programs . Unlike most Valley members we are the second major University in our State and are the largest state besides New Jersey population wise that has only one FBS level university in it
So anyway, that's the situation and history here; this was always the plan [ not leaving the Valley necessarily but the evolving of the university ] when we fought for and got the Missouri State name change via the state legislature. I look back at when I went thru MSU and we were a regional teachers college with a public affairs focus in a d-2 conference and no different than 5-6 other Missouri Universities that all had directional names and had to kiss the ass of MU for anything they wanted . Not today.
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby BEARZ77 » October 27th, 2021, 5:12 pm

Drakey wrote:Odd. I read an article that as of two years ago the average FBS school lost 8 million more per year than the average FCS school.


I did the math a while back between CUSA/Sunbelt and us playing in the MVCF league and it'd probably result in around 6 million more than current. Football outside the P-5 simply is a money loser . But those who argue the positives are convinced the "blue sky" advantages outweigh the costs. Not my budget to balance. :huh:
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby mvfcfan » October 27th, 2021, 5:16 pm

MSU SHOULD go to the CUSA if invited. I don't want to see them leave, but it would be the right move for them. I'm surprised Illinois State hasn't made an attempt to get into the MAC. Obviously SIU, UNI, and INSU are financially not in a position to go FBS.

Missouri State will never win a national title at the FCS level, but I'm fairly confident they could win half of their games at the FBS level and win a bowl game once in a while. The CUSA and Sun Belt are typically rated below the MVFC. I'll be curious to see where the AAC is after they lose their three top schools and add 6 CUSA schools.
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Re: REPORT: Murray to the Valley?

Postby MSUDuo » October 27th, 2021, 5:32 pm

mvfcfan wrote:MSU SHOULD go to the CUSA if invited. I don't want to see them leave, but it would be the right move for them. I'm surprised Illinois State hasn't made an attempt to get into the MAC. Obviously SIU, UNI, and INSU are financially not in a position to go FBS.

Missouri State will never win a national title at the FCS level, but I'm fairly confident they could win half of their games at the FBS level and win a bowl game once in a while. The CUSA and Sun Belt are typically rated below the MVFC. I'll be curious to see where the AAC is after they lose their three top schools and add 6 CUSA schools.


Just curious, why do you say MO State will never win a title at FCS level?

Obviously very difficult but I'd say we will have our chances if we stay and HCBP keeps things headed the way he does
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