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[rlh04d]

It's funny how I turned this into an anti-Bears discussion, when my prediction was that the Bears were going to have so much success in the next few years that Lusk would price himself out of their reach.

The only difference between MSU and the other 8 non-WSU teams in my prediction was that MSU was the only team I thought could definitely make a Sweet 16 in the next five years. No MVC team other than WSU/Bradley can afford to pay a coach with success what he's worth.

Predicting that MSU wouldn't be able to pay over $1million for a coach that starts realizing success isn't an insult to MSU ... seven other teams in the conference can't do it either.

[achrist70]

I am really enjoying how this has turned into talking about football, and how Bears fans suddenly feel that their program (with 2 playoff appearances all time) is superior to UNI's because they finished ahead of them in the Valley standings even though they finished with a worse overall record and lost to UNI.

[PantherSigEp]

UNI and MSU have different approaches when it comes to both athletic programs and university visions. That's pretty obvious given that MSU enrolls about 10K+ more students each year and serves a greater area of its state. It also sits in a metro area about 4 times as large as the Waterloo-Cedar Falls MSA, so compare them based on sheer numbers still seems pretty dang naive although the entire argument itself is just silly. Neither program was anything special this past year, or the year before that, or the year before that. Just shut up accept the fact that we're both mediocre until the results show otherwise.

[glm38]

It's funny how I turned this into an anti-Bears discussion, when my prediction was that the Bears were going to have so much success in the next few years that Lusk would price himself out of their reach.

The only difference between MSU and the other 8 non-WSU teams in my prediction was that MSU was the only team I thought could definitely make a Sweet 16 in the next five years. No MVC team other than WSU/Bradley can afford to pay a coach with success what he's worth.

Predicting that MSU wouldn't be able to pay over $1million for a coach that starts realizing success isn't an insult to MSU ... seven other teams in the conference can't do it either.

Your comments might have kicked it off but it obviously wasn't your intent to denigrate anyone as some of these subsequent posts have.

You make a very valid point that you've obviously thought a lot about. I don't think it's necessarily always true that a coach will bolt for big money. But it's certainly true in a lot of cases. I'm worried about losing Lusk down the road. I do think we'll pony up a decent salary if we keep on an upward trajectory.

[glm38]

UNI and MSU have different approaches when it comes to both athletic programs and university visions. That's pretty obvious given that MSU enrolls about 10K+ more students each year and serves a greater area of its state. It also sits in a metro area about 4 times as large as the Waterloo-Cedar Falls MSA, so compare them based on sheer numbers still seems pretty dang naive although the entire argument itself is just silly. Neither program was anything special this past year, or the year before that, or the year before that. Just shut up accept the fact that we're both mediocre until the results show otherwise.

I would be surprised if either program is mediocre for the next couple of years though.

[CaseyGarrisonforPrez]

If Lusk has success, MSU will pay him top dollar. I feel pretty confident in that fact. He could still leave, but I think he likes Springfield more than Cuonzo did.

With respect to football, MSU will be significantly better off once this lame duck Terry Allen season ends. 2015 and beyond look promising with the stadium upgrades, realignment possibilities, and a new coach that will unite the fans.

[Cdizzle]

If Lusk has success, MSU will pay him top dollar. I feel pretty confident in that fact. He could still leave, but I think he likes Springfield more than Cuonzo did.

With respect to football, MSU will be significantly better off once this lame duck Terry Allen season ends. 2015 and beyond look promising with the stadium upgrades, realignment possibilities, and a new coach that will unite the fans.

"top" dollar? Compared to what?

Top in the state? Seems unlikely.
Top in the Valley? Seems unlikely.
Top % of compensation by cattle? Could be.

Maybe you just meant that MSU would try to give him a raise and got caught up in hyperbole a little bit.

[BEARZ77]

All I can say uniftw is I've never seen a person as wrong about as many points in a single post as you have been . Why you think you know so much about MSU's administrative strategy, finances, and history of success or lack thereof, when you clearly have no clue is beyond me. I don't know where to start to counter your many off base perceptions they're so numerous.

How come if we've ignored every other sport at the expense of football we've been the only other school besides WSU and ISUr to win multiple All Sports trophies since we entered the league. Surely that couldn't happen if what you assert is true.

How come we've been the only school besides WSU to make it to a final Championship weekend in more than one major sport since we've joined the league.

How could we have won a league MBB championship more recently than you .

How could we have been bankrupting ourselves for football and yet in the same year complete a new state of the art Academic Support Center for our athletes, a new soccer complex, a new track and field stadium, a new all-student recreation center very much similar to the one MU built for it's students, as well as the considerable upgrades to the football stadium.

Your understanding of the locker room accessibility and construction time frame is so uninformed as to be laughable. You don't seem to understand JQH and HSC are attached and that the locker rooms in HSC had been greatly upgraded just the year before and that it was only our teams that walked down an adjoining corridor for the two arenas to those locker rooms . You don't put in half assed locker rooms in a 70 million dollar facility when you have superior ones available for use in close proximity, that then allows you the time to develop the financial backing to put something really special in as the finished product.

You should listen to PantherSigEp and rhl04d and realize no school besides WSU is operating at a high level financially right now, or if they are [Bradley ??] having that pay off in substantial tangible gains nationally. Your zeal to diss MSU and act as if UNI is somehow operating at a different level is simply not remotely accurate. Each school is having to make decisions yearly about where they throw limited dollars and where they cut back. I'm a big believer in infrastructure and that's why I feel our future is very promising because we simply have chosen to find ways to fund facility development at a level that I only see WSU as on par or better than us currently in the MVC. As far as coaches, we are no different than about 8 other teams in the MVC, we pay what we can afford when we think it's earned, but we will never be in position to outbid a BCS school who really wants our coaches and neither will you. Since your sweet 16 run, has the increase in coaches salary really bought you a clear advantage in the league standings?? I think your smart to pay Jake what you do to ensure as much continuity as you can, but make no mistake if he decides he wants to make a million plus and it's offered, you will not be in any better position to keep him than you were when McDermott wanted to move up or we were when Alford and ZO wanted to.

[rlh04d]

If Lusk has success, MSU will pay him top dollar.

Define top dollar. Has any MVC team other than WSU and Creighton EVER paid a coach more than $1 million a year?

Creighton, the team that was averaging 17k fans a game, and WSU, the team that averages 10.5k fans a game and charges by far the highest ticket prices, season and otherwise, of any Valley school? If any other school has any chance at joining that club, it's Bradley.

I have no doubt MSU will pay him MORE if Lusk has success. Maybe even second in the Valley. It's simply impossible to pay him "top dollar," or to even match what a low-level Power 6 school could offer, without developing a significant sugar daddy at a school like MSU. Even without the football program as a drain on finances, MSU can't draw fans, and even if they were selling out the arena for every game, can't charge the prices that WSU can.

And even without football expenses, and even with by FAR the highest attendance in the Valley, and by FAR the highest prices in the Valley, WSU still struggles to pay "top dollar."

Missouri State's reported revenue from basketball, 7/2012 - 6/2013: $2,105,340
Wichita State's reported revenue from basketball, same period: $5,369,577

Have some common sense about finances. Money has to come from somewhere. You can't pay "top dollar" when MSU makes 39% of the revenue of WSU.

No team is going to keep a successful coach at this level while averaging 55% of arena capacity.

[BEARZ77]

I'm not saying this to you rlh04d, just in general, but I don't know why some on this forum respond to Casey as if he represents the general thinking of the MSU fan base. Some perhaps, a majority hardly. I respect Casey's zeal, but he drinks somebody's Kool-Aid in too massive amounts.

At the same time in eagerness to play with Casey's often fantastical thinking, some pretty off base generalities about MSU start being bandied about as fact. The "can't draw fans" assertion is one. Traditionally we have been the 4th best draw in the Valley, not that far behind Bradley, and while it is not close to the WSU/CU levels it has been very respectable when compared nationally. We can and will draw fans to basketball; I think we had a fairly significant number of years where we led the Valley in combined [ WBB/MBB] attendance and both programs were making money. Not the case in the last few years, but the ability and past performance is certainly indicative of a repeat.

But yeah, anybody thinking we will pay the kind of dollars for a coach that would in anyway compete to keep him at MSU vs a significant BCS offer is in ya-ya land. And frankly, I disagree with even attempting to be in that arms race , for us and most similar Universities. Jacking up your costs to entice someone to stay for another year or so, and then they still bolt [ like Turgeon did] or worse you get stuck with a non-performing albatross like Lowry[SIU] . It didn't hurt WSU because they a had the resources to stay and go beyond the salary level they moved to keep Turgeon another year, but it killed SIU.

Coaches are going to come and go at our level, but facilities and infrastructure don't, at least not every few years, which is why I like our current approach to trying to build a better, sustainable product. It's what can work for us, and that's all that really matters .