MSU @ SIU, 2/8, 6pm, ESPN3

[bleach]

I said it then and I continue to believe it now, MSU set the program back a decade when they fired Barry.

Go Valley!

Go Shocks!

Then you would have been wrong then and are now.
The Bears have won ONE regular season championship. When did that happen? The program is now stocking up some real nice young talent to build a long term program from. You may think we were there with Barry but when he left we were getting pretty bad.

Alford 1995-1999 4 seasons 78-48 62%
Hinson 1999-2008 9 seasons 169-117 69%
Martin 2008-2011 3 seasons 61-41 67%
Lusk 2011-2012 2 seasons (excludes 2013-14) 27-38 -41% (that's minus forty one percent)

Alford's 4 seasons vs Hinson's Last 4 winning percentages:
95-96 57% 04-05 59%
96-97 73% 05-06 71%
97-98 50% 06-07 67%
98-99 67% (lost ncaa regional final) 07-08 52%

Alford's career winning percentage 62% vs Hinson's last 4 is 61%

Just my take.

If you remove the first year of each coach which has little to do with that coach, things look much different. Barry followed a Sweet 16 with 4 starters returning and had his best year but it should not be a plus for him. That team greatly underachieved. Zo followed a Barry team that was horrid (The place Barry had gotten to) and struggled but built it back up fast. Lusk gets no credit for this year? It's the first year his recruits have any experience. Lusk also took over a team that lost a lot of its recruits to Tennessee and had little chance to recruit anything long term.

[Wufan]

Barry had one losing season in 10 years at SMSU/MSU (year 2). He won 22 or more games three times and went to 4 NITs. If you discount year 1, his record is 146-106…58% winning percentage. His last season, his "horrid" team went 17-16…immediately following two 22 win seasons.

[glm38]

MSU fans are IMHO too harsh on Barry Hinson. That doesn't mean it wasn't time for MSU to move on from BH though.

Spot on, however the MSU crowd fails to acknowledge anything positive or good regarding BH. If it had been something along the lines of "He had a respectable run but nearly a decade without a return to the Dance it was time to part ways" I could understand. However, they carry on like he was a sub-500 coach who never put the program in position to be a winner. This simply isn't the case and in the 2005-06 season Barry was screwed and Coach Martin only achieved NIT status, the same as Barry.

Go Valley!

Go Shocks!!

Certainly not all MSU fans don't acknowledge that Barry was a good coach. I think that that and I believe most Bears fans do as well. But there was a feeling among MSU administration and Bears fans that he (Barry) had taken us as far as he could. And at that point in his career I think that was true.

You can compare records all you want. Yes Barry's winning % was comparable or better than Cuonzo's and Alford's. BUT in 9 years (despite some pretty good talent) he took us to 0 league championships, 0 wins at arch madness, and 0 NCAA appearances. In a much shorter tenure Cuonzo won a league championship and Alford took us to a sweet 16. We also had post season success under Spoon. To most passionate fans "good" just isn't enough.

Yes there are a few sourpusses that hold a grudge against Barry. But the vast majority of Bears fans don't. Personally I think he was (and is) a great guy. Remember when several on this board predicted that when SIU came to Springfield for the 1st time last year it would be a debacle and he would be treated horribly? Didn't happen. He got a standing ovation instead. And this past week he got a very nice round of applause. Not a single boo that I could hear either time. That says a lot right there doesn't it?

[Bear4Life]

MSU fans are IMHO too harsh on Barry Hinson. That doesn't mean it wasn't time for MSU to move on from BH though.

Spot on, however the MSU crowd fails to acknowledge anything positive or good regarding BH. If it had been something along the lines of "He had a respectable run but nearly a decade without a return to the Dance it was time to part ways" I could understand. However, they carry on like he was a sub-500 coach who never put the program in position to be a winner. This simply isn't the case and in the 2005-06 season Barry was screwed and Coach Martin only achieved NIT status, the same as Barry.

Go Valley!

Go Shocks!!

Certainly not all MSU fans don't acknowledge that Barry was a good coach. I think that that and I believe most Bears fans do as well. But there was a feeling among MSU administration and Bears fans that he (Barry) had taken us as far as he could. And at that point in his career I think that was true.

You can compare records all you want. Yes Barry's winning % was comparable or better than Cuonzo's and Alford's. BUT in 9 years (despite some pretty good talent) he took us to 0 league championships, 0 wins at arch madness, and 0 NCAA appearances. In a much shorter tenure Cuonzo won a league championship and Alford took us to a sweet 16. We also had post season success under Spoon. To most passionate fans "good" just isn't enough.

Yes there are a few sourpusses that hold a grudge against Barry. But the vast majority of Bears fans don't. Personally I think he was (and is) a great guy. Remember when several on this board predicted that when SIU came to Springfield for the 1st time last year it would be a debacle and he would be treated horribly? Didn't happen. He got a standing ovation instead. And this past week he got a very nice round of applause. Not a single boo that I could hear either time. That says a lot right there doesn't it?

Great Post...This is the general stance from the Mo State fan perspective

[bleach]

Certainly not all MSU fans don't acknowledge that Barry was a good coach. I think that that and I believe most Bears fans do as well. But there was a feeling among MSU administration and Bears fans that he (Barry) had taken us as far as he could. And at that point in his career I think that was true.

You can compare records all you want. Yes Barry's winning % was comparable or better than Cuonzo's and Alford's. BUT in 9 years (despite some pretty good talent) he took us to 0 league championships, 0 wins at arch madness, and 0 NCAA appearances. In a much shorter tenure Cuonzo won a league championship and Alford took us to a sweet 16. We also had post season success under Spoon. To most passionate fans "good" just isn't enough.

Yes there are a few sourpusses that hold a grudge against Barry. But the vast majority of Bears fans don't. Personally I think he was (and is) a great guy. Remember when several on this board predicted that when SIU came to Springfield for the 1st time last year it would be a debacle and he would be treated horribly? Didn't happen. He got a standing ovation instead. And this past week he got a very nice round of applause. Not a single boo that I could hear either time. That says a lot right there doesn't it?

I've never hated Barry the person. There isn't a nicer guy! As a coach though, Barry always found a way to lose when he couldn't afford to. Barry won some games. Maybe enough for most MVC teams and fans but not enough for Mo State or me. No championships of anything! Barry was set up with a can't lose situation and underachieved then after the local talent dried up the records did too. Some may think 1 game over .500 is not horrid but I do unless you are in rebuild mode which shouldn't be the case after NINE years. I hope SIU loves him and keeps him forever. I hope Barry turns them around. I hope the Salukis become feared again. I don't think these will happen based on my observations of him when here. BARRY IS A GREAT GUY! What is that really worth as a coach?