Which of these team would you be okay with joining the MVC?

[usmcsaluki]

And actually as far as I'm aware the MVC was never in Chicago until 8 years ago. Indiana State gets a lot of students from Indianapolis and you know how we do it? It's called advertising aka billboards, recruiters, etc. It's not because we play in the same conference as IUPUI. What a joke. Some people on this board are clueless. They just regurgitate whatever the idea of the day is in the MVC because they think the MVC is so awesome. No one outside of our local communities gives a rip about the MVC. I know someone that was raised in Bloomington and went to ISU because they got a scholarship to go there, not because of ISU being in the Big Ten with IU. I have an ex from Gary that went there because they had the field she wanted to major in, not because of Valpo or Loyola being in the MVC. This argument of adding markets for students is just beyond dumb. If your schools want students then advertise and give people a reason to go there. It's really not that complicated.

The market desire is there for TV contract money, not necessarily for student enrollment.

[keane1]

UIC maintains our Chicago presence and they're no worse than Loyola was when they were added.

I beg to differ on this point. UIC is nowhere close to where LUC was prior to joining the MVC. I will back up my statement with stats from KenPom going back 12 years prior to moving, assuming UIC moves next year:

LUC - 12 year avg ranking ('02-'13): 172, Low 63, High 282
UIC - 12 year avg ranking ('10-'21): 247, Low 182, High 335

I will say this, in looking at UIC stats, the prior 8 seasons ('02-'09) their average was 117, Low 62, High 170. So, something has definitely gone south with their program. The MVC does not need to add another 200+ team, we have enough of those already.

[unipanther99]

I've always been curious about UNI fans thoughts about expansion as it relates to travel. Do most of you basically understand that any expansion (outside of the Dakota schools) is going to have to be further away from you than closer? On that note - I like St. Thomas in Minneapolis - but I know you can't sell that right now.

And I wonder why UW-Milwaukee isn't an option. To me they make way more sense than UMKC and Omaha.

Yeah, I really hope we are "saving a spot" for St. Thomas when they are ready. They're not there yet.

Travel is pretty much assumed at UNI. Murray will be an adventure, but Omaha or KC are easy all-interstate bus rides. Arlington will be a flight no matter what, but easier to fly commercial for the non-revenue sports. Kind of similar with Belmont, but there aren't any local direct options for Nashville.

There was a time I would have wanted Milwaukee or even Green Bay, but the shine has kind of worn off those programs. I'm not sure they have as much up-side potential, and we don't have much of an alumni base in that area. But I'd be all in for Green Bay if they could whip us up a few more Koch brothers (maybe grandkids at this point).

[IllinoisState]

I've always been curious about UNI fans thoughts about expansion as it relates to travel. Do most of you basically understand that any expansion (outside of the Dakota schools) is going to have to be further away from you than closer? On that note - I like St. Thomas in Minneapolis - but I know you can't sell that right now.

And I wonder why UW-Milwaukee isn't an option. To me they make way more sense than UMKC and Omaha.

Yeah, I really hope we are "saving a spot" for St. Thomas when they are ready. They're not there yet.

Travel is pretty much assumed at UNI. Murray will be an adventure, but Omaha or KC are easy all-interstate bus rides. Arlington will be a flight no matter what, but easier to fly commercial for the non-revenue sports. Kind of similar with Belmont, but there aren't any local direct options for Nashville.

There was a time I would have wanted Milwaukee or even Green Bay, but the shine has kind of worn off those programs. I'm not sure they have as much up-side potential, and we don't have much of an alumni base in that area. But I'd be all in for Green Bay if they could whip us up a few more Koch brothers (maybe grandkids at this point).

I'd be okay with St. Thomas too. And wouldn't the private schools rather have them than UMKC?

Go to St. Thomas and say if you can do X by 20?? We would then like to discuss adding you.

[BCPanther]

I don't understand the anger from InSU fans, unless it's just the travel thing.

UNI (in 1991) was the last addition to the MVC that wasn't an easy drive for the Sycamores. Evansville, Loyola, Valpo, and Belmont came after. Murray is now assumed and would become yet another close trip. UIC basically replaces Loyola.

I would say the Sycamores have had it pretty good when it comes to MVC expansion. This isn't the Wabash Valley Conference, but it's trended that direction lately. I'm glad we are expanding the footprint.

And as far as basketball goes... Not every team is getting in the NCAA tournament. With an increased conference schedule, some combination of UTA/KC/Omaha's NET should be manageable, and not so much of a boat anchor, even if they aren't winning a ton. As Judge Smails would say, "the world needs ditch diggers too."

I've always been curious about UNI fans thoughts about expansion as it relates to travel. Do most of you basically understand that any expansion (outside of the Dakota schools) is going to have to be further away from you than closer? On that note - I like St. Thomas in Minneapolis - but I know you can't sell that right now.

And I wonder why UW-Milwaukee isn't an option. To me they make way more sense than UMKC and Omaha.

The Dakota schools are further away from us than anyone realizes, they are all flights for us in football though we did bus to SDSU this year to make up some COVID money. Cedar Falls to Fargo is nearly identical distance-wise to Springfield to Arlington and Grand Forks is even further. I wish there was a way to make football work without the Dakotas and to let them go develop Summit League football.

We completely understand that geography puts us on a plane more than anybody else and that makes the pearl clutching about Arlington (who is a great add) extra annoying. Though Omaha or Kansas City are both probably bus trips for us.

UNI people have told me that there is zero trust in the leadership at Milwaukee and no ability for them to increase budgets plus Milwaukee is trending downwards in population and they don't really add another market because there is so much overlap with Chicago media.

[unipanther99]

Don't want to go too far down the football rabbit hole, but when the Gateway Conference lost Eastern Illinois, that was kind of the beginning of everything getting weird.

If we could ditch the Dakotas while hanging onto WIU (difficult), add Murray and we could survive at 8 teams. But it would be a challenge. If only Western Ill was an hour north and had a following in the Quad Cities, they could be in the mix for an all-sport invite. But they are a struggle-bus program in nowheresville.

[tribecalledquest]

I don't understand the anger from InSU fans, unless it's just the travel thing.

UNI (in 1991) was the last addition to the MVC that wasn't an easy drive for the Sycamores. Evansville, Loyola, Valpo, and Belmont came after. Murray is now assumed and would become yet another close trip. UIC basically replaces Loyola.

I would say the Sycamores have had it pretty good when it comes to MVC expansion. This isn't the Wabash Valley Conference, but it's trended that direction lately. I'm glad we are expanding the footprint.

And as far as basketball goes... Not every team is getting in the NCAA tournament. With an increased conference schedule, some combination of UTA/KC/Omaha's NET should be manageable, and not so much of a boat anchor, even if they aren't winning a ton. As Judge Smails would say, "the world needs ditch diggers too."

I've always been curious about UNI fans thoughts about expansion as it relates to travel. Do most of you basically understand that any expansion (outside of the Dakota schools) is going to have to be further away from you than closer? On that note - I like St. Thomas in Minneapolis - but I know you can't sell that right now.

And I wonder why UW-Milwaukee isn't an option. To me they make way more sense than UMKC and Omaha.

The Dakota schools are further away from us than anyone realizes, they are all flights for us in football though we did bus to SDSU this year to make up some COVID money. Cedar Falls to Fargo is nearly identical distance-wise to Springfield to Arlington and Grand Forks is even further. I wish there was a way to make football work without the Dakotas and to let them go develop Summit League football.

We completely understand that geography puts us on a plane more than anybody else and that makes the pearl clutching about Arlington (who is a great add) extra annoying. Though Omaha or Kansas City are both probably bus trips for us.

UNI people have told me that there is zero trust in the leadership at Milwaukee and no ability for them to increase budgets plus Milwaukee is trending downwards in population and they don't really add another market because there is so much overlap with Chicago media.

Good stuff. Agreed on Milwaukee. They need to be tied with Green Bay probably as well.

I also didn't realize the Dakota schools were so damn far away. Doesn't make sense for anyone.

Agreed on UTA. I actually like adding them. A commercial flight isn't a huge deal. I understand UIC as well. I don't like UMKC but I know the new commissioner has a lot of ties to Kansas City.

[SalukiWorld]

I'd add Murray and UIC and leave it at 12. I get what makes UT Arlington attractive but I hate going so far out of the MVC footprint.

[tribecalledquest]

I'd add Murray and UIC and leave it at 12. I get what makes UT Arlington attractive but I hate going so far out of the MVC footprint.

It's funny how the footprint has changed over the history of the MVC. Which says a lot about the resiliency and ability to change the MVC has had over the many, many years.

Tulsa was a fixture in the league for a long time and no one batted an eye - DFW isn't really much further than that.

[DUBulldog]

I'm a hard no on UIC because of their actions toward Valley schools and fans, historically. They can rot as far as I'm concerned. Act like a preschool, you can continue to play in a preschool league.

Can you explain this? Not doubting you, but I've never heard anything about this.