MVC in preliminary talks with ORU?

[REDBIRD FAN 77]

Perhaps I'm wrong but I believe the example chosen was more to highlight a recent lack of forward thinking in the priorities of ORU. They have every right to do what they do as a university but I think we all want a conference member that will be willing to think of the MVC as an organization that it can positively contribute to and help all of the organizations grow and further acheive in all capacities. Outside of a few above-average athletics I'm not sure where Oral Roberts fits that role.

Why would ORU's stance on that one issue keep other MVC organizations from "growing and further achieving in all capacities"? Are BYU, Notre Dame and countless other schools no longer top notch academic institutions for having similar values?

In your personal definition, would objecting to Obamacare's requirement that health insurance be required to pay for birth control for everyone be considered a "lack of forward thinking?" Because if it is, than about every single religious institution, not just those that are catholic, are off the table since they all joined a lawsuit originated by Notre Dame challenging the law.

When evaluating every single school's political position on individual issues as part of the expansion process, you will rapidly run out of candidates.

Agreed

[CaliRdBrd]

Man I don't get the anti-ORU crowd. Getting into the MVC will elevate their program immensely. They will have more fans, increase their budget, and plus it puts us back into Oklahoma which we have not been since Tulsa left.

Selfishly I love the close proximity of Tulsa to our fans in Springfield. Really easy drive down I-44. Really easy drive for them too. Close proximity to Wichita as well. They aren't perfect but they are at worst an adequate replacement for CU.

Personally, this is the main reason I have no interest in adding ORU. I'm not interested in elevating the status of individual programs that are anxious to join the Valley. I want us to go after programs that will elevate the Valley.

[nokota]

Perhaps I'm wrong but I believe the example chosen was more to highlight a recent lack of forward thinking in the priorities of ORU. They have every right to do what they do as a university but I think we all want a conference member that will be willing to think of the MVC as an organization that it can positively contribute to and help all of the organizations grow and further acheive in all capacities. Outside of a few above-average athletics I'm not sure where Oral Roberts fits that role.

Why would ORU's stance on that one issue keep other MVC organizations from "growing and further achieving in all capacities"? Are BYU, Notre Dame and countless other schools no longer top notch academic institutions for having similar values?

In your personal definition, would objecting to Obamacare's requirement that health insurance be required to pay for birth control for everyone be considered a "lack of forward thinking?" Because if it is, than about every single religious institution, not just those that are catholic, are off the table since they all joined a lawsuit originated by Notre Dame challenging the law.

When evaluating every single school's political position on individual issues as part of the expansion process, you will rapidly run out of candidates.

Nicely stated.

[unipanther99]

I get that you have your own personal agenda here, but if that is the standard you are using, you might as well strike every single religious institution from the list of possible members because none of them are going to come out openly in favor of LGBT rights.

Definitely not true. Like I said, even Creighton takes a reasonable stance. That's all I'm asking for.
http://www.creighton.edu/chc/counseling ... /index.php

I actually have similar concerns about Belmont. They've moderated their position in the last year or two, but in 2010 they fired their soccer coach for being gay. I'm uncomfortable having my alma mater associated with a university that does something like that. I understand people have a difference of opinion on this issue, but I would have to imagine actions like these are concerning to at least some of the university administrators who will be making the decision on expansion.

And also, what about ORU's history? They were NAIA as recently as the late 80's and haven't made it past the first round of the NCAA tournament since. I really feel like there are better fits out there.

[TylerDurden]

My major concern would be making a move before having a final answer on the availability of Dayton and/or St Louis.

That aside, I'm ok with Oral Bob. Not the sexy pick. But not a lot of downside. Of course you want to find the next great thing in expansion, though.

I think it's worth playing a season at 9 teams to see if something opens up, before adding Oral Bob.

St. Louis is not an option. Please eliminate them from this discussion.

[EvilleAce]

"The resume of ORU's men's basketball program over the last nine years includes seven 20-win seasons and seven postseason tournament appearances (three NCAA Tournaments, two NITs and two CITs)." - Tulsa World

How is this not a good resume?

I'm an Aces fan that lives in Tulsa and would love to see Valley basketball back in Oklahoma.

[moshock]

I have no problem with them being religiously affiliated, and I don't want to make this too political, but given the events of today and tomorrow I would say ORU is out of the mainstream of current MVC institutions on the issue of LGBT rights. Even Creighton as a Catholic institution has a Gay-Straight Alliance and adopts standard approach to dealing with these issues.

I can think of a lot of reasons to be opposed to ORU, but their position on LGBT rights seems to be the about the weakest one ever.

I get that you have your own personal agenda here, but if that is the standard you are using, you might as well strike every single religious institution from the list of possible members because none of them are going to come out openly in favor of LGBT rights.

If this is the kind of bright line test that some members of this conference are now advocating, I'm glad we are leaving. Apparently determining the quality of an athletic department is secondary now to a school's stance on LGBT rights. What litmus test issue is next for potential members -- the schools stance on abortion? Mandatory health care insurance coverage of birth control?

It is disappointing when one is unable to evaluate things quantitatively, but relies instead on things that are not even determinative to one's quality as an athletic program. Get off the soapbox.

Nice post DJA

I am not in favor of ORU joining the conference. My reasoning is based on their athletic department. They would not be a bottom dweller in basketball but they may never compete at the top either. I don't know that we will attract someone who would compete year in and year out.

There are worse choices out there.

"Forward thinking" - meh

[Veritas]

I get that you have your own personal agenda here, but if that is the standard you are using, you might as well strike every single religious institution from the list of possible members because none of them are going to come out openly in favor of LGBT rights.

Definitely not true. Like I said, even Creighton takes a reasonable stance. That's all I'm asking for.
http://www.creighton.edu/chc/counseling ... /index.php

I actually have similar concerns about Belmont. They've moderated their position in the last year or two, but in 2010 they fired their soccer coach for being gay. I'm uncomfortable having my alma mater associated with a university that does something like that. I understand people have a difference of opinion on this issue, but I would have to imagine actions like these are concerning to at least some of the university administrators who will be making the decision on expansion.

And also, what about ORU's history? They were NAIA as recently as the late 80's and haven't made it past the first round of the NCAA tournament since. I really feel like there are better fits out there.

Good grief UNIpanther99, stop trying to be a social-political terrorist. If ORU gets accepted, and that offends you, then you can boycott the UNI home game against ORU and hang out at the LGBT bar or support group meeting that night and give them all your support.

[CaseyGarrisonforPrez]

"The resume of ORU's men's basketball program over the last nine years includes seven 20-win seasons and seven postseason tournament appearances (three NCAA Tournaments, two NITs and two CITs)." - Tulsa World

How is this not a good resume?

I'm an Aces fan that lives in Tulsa and would love to see Valley basketball back in Oklahoma.

Amen. I don't get the resistance. We can all eat Hideaway Pizza--which is like the best pizza in the world by the way--and the western schools don't have far to go. Denver and New Mexico State aren't exactly close.

[ptownbraves]

It is difficult to get excited about adding a school like Oral Roberts, but the reality is, the MVC just lost its highest performing basketball program in recent years and as a result, a lot of its appeal. There just aren't a lot of private, Midwest schools with solid basketball programs who would see the MVC as a step-up from where they are at.