WE ARE ALL SHOCKERS!

[rlh04d]

SIU, while holding many of their opponents to low point totals, used the strategy of slowing the game down. WSU plays at a much faster pace than almost any other "mid-major" I've ever seen in the tournament, so point totals are higher. I believe WSU also sends their opponents to the line more frequently. WSU has also played higher average seeds and higher average AP ranked teams in their run, IIRC.

I agree that you play with a higher tempo than those SIU teams so the points per game stats might be a little misleading, however I wouldn't say "WSU plays at a much faster pace than almost any mid-major".

That's not actually what I said. I said in the tournament. And what I actually meant was successful mid-majors. From what I remembers, the gameplan of most "mid-major" teams in the tournament is to slow down the game and win from the perimeter. I'm probably exaggerating that, but I think we play faster and more physical than most teams of our ilk that have found success in the tournament. I'm not saying better, just faster. Certainly faster than any of the SIU teams, though.

As I've told you in the past, I thought Wichita State's defense against Creighton in that game was excellent. I had no problems with how we defended that game. Putting up those offensive numbers against that defense was nothing short of incredible (I'll never forget that incredibly well defended play where I believe Gibbs? made a 3 as he was falling backwards out of bounds with the clock expiring ... it haunts my dreams). Don't downplay your team's accomplishments by trying to downplay our defense -- we've shown how good it is in this tournament. There aren't many teams that have shot better than 40% against us, and Creighton and Evansville both deserve a lot of credit for doing so (Detroit doesn't ... we had a gameplan for them, but it wasn't defense; we just decided to outrun them and use our superior depth).

[derekr812]

From a Aces fan; I can at least tell all my die hard IU fans at work at least we beat a final
four team twice. Go Shockers and show the country that the Valley teams are for real.

[MoBraves]

This is why the MVC is the best conference in America! We don't have the best teams year in and year out but we all support each other after the conference season is over. It really is a cool thing to see all of the shocker and bluejay love on twitter by other valley fans over the past couple weeks. Way to go shockers!!!!

Absolutely Jackwagon!

[unipanther99]

I didn't mean to take anything away from the great Saluki teams defensively, but I'll stick by my statement. This Shocker team plays tremendous team defense and stepped it up a notch when it counted most.

UNI almost beat Louisville earlier this season, there's no question in my mind that the Shockers can take them down if they continue to play like they have.

[shockem]

From a Aces fan; I can at least tell all my die hard IU fans at work at least we beat a final
four team twice. Go Shockers and show the country that the Valley teams are for real.

Go ahead, rub it in.

[Deanthonybowdenfan]

Don't downplay your team's accomplishments by trying to downplay our defense -- we've shown how good it is in this tournament. There aren't many teams that have shot better than 40% against us, and Creighton and Evansville both deserve a lot of credit for doing so

I never meant to downplay your defense. I have been saying in this entire thread that your a GREAT defensive team. All I was saying is that I'm not sure that it was better than a couple of those SIU teams. It is not a knock on WSU by any means, it is more of a testament to my opinion of how amazingly tough the SIU defense was in a couple of their years. I think you may be taking it wrong, because it is like comparing Michael Jordan to Lebron James------ WSU defense is one of the best in the entire country, BUT.... SIU defense MIGHT have been even better.

P.S. I truely think both WSU and Creighton could be in the Final 4, if we shot it just average we could have beat duke. We could have met for a fourth time! I just think this was a crazyyyy year for the Valley. We had a final 4 (and counting) WSU, a Creighton team that when shooting average (by their standards) was good enough to get to the Final 4............and yet, neither team lost less than 5 times in the Valley. Says a lot about our league IMO. I'm saddened by the what-could-of-been from Creighton, but I'm happy for WSU. It's hard not to like a couple under-dog programs from the heartland. I was hoping y'all could play Kansas and you would have kicked their ass I guarantee it.

In the end both CU and WSU, and all other Valley Basketball Programs for that matter are very similar to each other in the big picture. Much rather it be you guys than KU or UNC or some spoiled fan base who gets to go to the final 4 every few years. I have nothing against Louisville, but I hope you play angry and kick their ass just so you can beat the hell out of Syracuse or Michigan, I really don't like either of those programs at all.

[iSASO]

Isn't it true that not a single WSU player was on the Valley All-Defensive Team?

[rlh04d]

Isn't it true that not a single WSU player was on the Valley All-Defensive Team?

I think the list that was released was actually the Valley's All Defensive 2nd Team. The 1st team was just listed as "WSU."

[m-v-c]

This is why the MVC is the best conference in America! We don't have the best teams year in and year out but we all support each other after the conference season is over. It really is a cool thing to see all of the shocker and bluejay love on twitter by other valley fans over the past couple weeks. Way to go shockers!!!!

Love this! Such a great conference, so much history, only hope everyone can just enjoy it. In this era of conference-hopping, the MVC (so far) has endured, and it can continue to if everyone sticks together.

I would really love for the MVC to take the next step ... but we HAVE to make moves to get into a major TV deal.

Next year, if Saint Louis and Dayton go to the Big East, a HUGE move needs to be made to cannibalize the A-10, specifically with VCU, George Mason, La Salle, Saint Joseph's, and Richmond.

That would be a conference with three Final Fours in the last 10 years, plus ... what? 10 times making at least the Sweet 16s? That's a 14 team conference where I believe 9 of them were top 100 RPIs last year. That is a conference that makes money. That is a conference that gets a TV deal and east-coast attention.

Get. This. Done. The Valley will survive regardless ... but this will make the Valley IMPORTANT. The Valley has spent too long just letting things happen and being content with existing. This is the time for leadership and forward-thinking. Do NOT let this opportunity go to waste, Valley ... or you're going to lose Wichita as well.

There is no reason we can't have a 14 team conference (just call it "The Valley") with those teams signing a $2 million TV deal with ESPN, CBS, or Fox. Just do SOMETHING. Oral Roberts is NOT it.

I've seen opinions on realignment on this board (and others) before. I just don't agree with it. The MVC presidents realize that a 10-team league that makes geographic sense and where eveyrone plays each other (resulting in familiarity) is more stable than a bigger league where there is not the same closeness and therefore is always going to be instability.

Look at the conferences that have expanded to 12, 14 teams and were spread out geographically. With the exception of the biggest football conferences...how many of them have built themselves for long-term success? Almost all of them have had trouble maintaining stability. The WAC used to be a top 8 conference; it is now all but gone. Conference USA is going to be a shell of itself and has turned a lot of good basketball programs to mush (see: Tulsa, UTEP, UAB, Houston) because its a spread-out mess with no commonality. The Atlantic 10 has stayed ahead of the curve for now but is always going to be susceptible to poaching, because it reached for short-term solutions halfway across the country and refuses to get a solid core of programs in an area close together that will stick together long-term. They could do it-there are tons of basketball schools in the East-but they've chosen not to, and with it they've chosen instability. Even for CU fans, could easily see it happening with the new Big East. If the league goes to 12 teams and then isn't the power that everyone is hoping, could easily see the Midwest schools in the conference splitting off and forming their own league, one that makes more sense than schools like CU traveling to Providence for a conference game.

Don't see why the MVC would want to get involved in this game, and don't see why Wichita State would want to travel across country for conference games when it can play teams in its area and still have the same access to a Final 4. As long as MVC schools understand that basketball is their ticket and don't try a pipe dream grab at BCS money that would be a waste of time (the big boys will form their own league soon and probably leave the NCAA, taking the big $ with them), the league will survive. Oral Roberts isn't a perfect solution, but it's a good basketball school in a big city (and a city with MVC history), and most importantly there is nobody better begging to join the Valley. St. Louis would make the most sense, but they're always going to have peter envy for the new Big East.

[rlh04d]

Don't see why the MVC would want to get involved in this game, and don't see why Wichita State would want to travel across country for conference games when it can play teams in its area and still have the same access to a Final 4.

Because Wichita State doesn't have the same access to the Final Four. If the MVC is a one-bid conference in the future, WSU has to win the conference tournament every season to make the tournament. And you have to make the tournament to make the Final Four.

If WSU can't play good enough teams in conference to help build an NCAA tournament profile, then the MVC absolutely hurts their chances at making the tournament.

Yes, the Valley is a very stable conference. And if we want to be the #12th best conference in the country and stable, struggling to keep SIU afloat with an extra $100k a year, then being stable is what we should focus on. Apparently eight teams in this conference need a stable conference. Wichita State needs a conference that will increase it's NCAA tournament resume every year, provide money to compete on a larger scale, provide television exposure, etc. The same things that Creighton needed -- and that's why Creighton is gone. A quiet, stable MVC is okay for getting a team to the Sweet 16 every few years. It isn't a conference that gets a TV contract or high level recruits or is in a position to handle expansion in any way other than poaching from one-bid conferences.

Wichita State and Creighton have the same dreams and goals for the future. Creighton is gone. What do you think happens the first time Wichita gets a similar opportunity? Where do you think the Valley is after that? Probably a decent, stable conference that will survive long-term ... but not much better than the MCC. That'll be a top 15 conference nationally that gets one NCAA tournament bid, as a very high seed, and maybe have two teams in the top 100 RPI.

There are a lot of teams struggling financially in this conference. Is the Arch Madness deal with CBS even going to continue without Creighton -- and if it does, will it continue without Wichita? Those teams relying on NCAA payouts ... what shape are they going to be in when the 7 units provided by WSU and Creighton turns into 1 unit provided by the conference champ losing in the first round as a 15 seed? How much would losing those two cut into whatever tiny amount of money ESPN gives us for filler content on ESPN3? How many MVC games ever get on TV again? What will attendance look like without Creighton and Wichita coming to town? What happens if Wichita heads off to the A-10 and grabs one or three MVC programs to provide geographic balance? How's that for stability?

The Valley doesn't have to get involved in this game. But Creighton and Wichita are.

I understand the romantic allure of staying with your conference and maintaining historical ties. However, I also understand the practicality of needing money and exposure in today's sports world to be relevant. The only thing that truly keeps the Valley stable is that its members lack options. As for Creighton and the future stability of the Big East ... even if the Big East implodes, the Valley would welcome Creighton back with open arms. It's a risk, but it's a risk with tremendous upside, and the only downside is ... they're back to where they started. With an extra $3.5 million a year for however long they're gone.