#5 WSU vs Bradley

[Aces1982]

See this? Here is the quote.


Lets take a look at Walt Lemon vs. Fred Van Vleet and you tell me who you want. (Using stats from Valley site which only posts top 10)

Scoring: #4. Lemon 17.1, FVV not in top 15
Assists: #1. FVV 5.4, Lemon #5 3.9
FT%: #7 FVV .829
Steals: #3 Lemon 2.1, FVV #4 1.8
3PT%: #4 FVV .429, Lemon not in top 10
A/TO: #1 FVV 4.6, Lemon not in top 10
Minutes Played: #2 Lemon 33.4, FVV #3 32.6

Lemon: 4 categories in top 10
FVV: 6 categories in top 10

[Cdizzle]

See this? Here is the quote.


Lets take a look at Walt Lemon vs. Fred Van Vleet and you tell me who you want. (Using stats from Valley site which only posts top 10)

Scoring: #4. Lemon 17.1, FVV not in top 15
Assists: #1. FVV 5.4, Lemon #5 3.9
FT%: #7 FVV .829
Steals: #3 Lemon 2.1, FVV #4 1.8
3PT%: #4 FVV .429, Lemon not in top 10
A/TO: #1 FVV 4.6, Lemon not in top 10
Minutes Played: #2 Lemon 33.4, FVV #3 32.6

Lemon: 4 categories in top 10
FVV: 6 categories in top 10

6>4. Even your lame defense is defenseless!

[shocktheheart]

See this? Here is the quote.


Lets take a look at Walt Lemon vs. Fred Van Vleet and you tell me who you want. (Using stats from Valley site which only posts top 10)

Scoring: #4. Lemon 17.1, FVV not in top 15
Assists: #1. FVV 5.4, Lemon #5 3.9
FT%: #7 FVV .829
Steals: #3 Lemon 2.1, FVV #4 1.8
3PT%: #4 FVV .429, Lemon not in top 10
A/TO: #1 FVV 4.6, Lemon not in top 10
Minutes Played: #2 Lemon 33.4, FVV #3 32.6

Lemon: 4 categories in top 10
FVV: 6 categories in top 10

Can you have a debate or conversation without being immature and hateful? I'm still waiting on the answer of why you like Lemon specifically on stats over FVV

[shocktheheart]

I still don't get why you like Lemon better. Is it just the scoring? Other stats they are similar or FVV has a very big lead in.

The only reason I could come up with was that FVV plays for WSU and Lemon does not. I'm guessing that's probably one of the only reasons why he entered the debate. I would expect this kind of stuff from immature 20 year old college students but not from a 50+ year old man. Pretty sad considering the age alone.

It's also no wonder he purposely left out a key stat like FG%. Lemon shoots way more shots to get his points. FVV stays within the offense and is more efficient. But I guess that stat just isn't important enough for all of us "blinders" out here.

I agree that I would rather have FVV, but their situations and responsibilities are very different...I'm not sure if relied on as heavily as Lemon, and targeted by defenses as heavily, that FVV would be able to put up the points Lemon does. Could also argue Lemon on WSU would be a different player too...I could be wrong though, and we will never really know. I think in the end these are both great players...1 is just on a great team as well.

Good point. I still think more of Lemon's problem is he is a man without a true position. Not a good enough ballhandler to be a PG, not a good enough shooter to be a SG, and not tall enough to be a true wing player. He is a talented slasher, just takes way too many shots to get his points.

[Aces1982]

Here would be my reason without watching any of them playing and seeing only the stats provided.

One is averaging 17 and one is not.
One only averages 1.4 assist more then the other.
The steals are even.
3Pt FG%--Again, without seeing either play and I am only going by stats...one has a higher %. I would conclude he has a higher % because he doesn't shoot as much because he doesn't average as much.
A/TO one person is clearly ahead
Minutes played-toss up.

So with all that is given. And I hadn't seen either play or no nothing about them. I would take Lemon.

[Aces1982]

See this? Here is the quote.


Lets take a look at Walt Lemon vs. Fred Van Vleet and you tell me who you want. (Using stats from Valley site which only posts top 10)

Scoring: #4. Lemon 17.1, FVV not in top 15
Assists: #1. FVV 5.4, Lemon #5 3.9
FT%: #7 FVV .829
Steals: #3 Lemon 2.1, FVV #4 1.8
3PT%: #4 FVV .429, Lemon not in top 10
A/TO: #1 FVV 4.6, Lemon not in top 10
Minutes Played: #2 Lemon 33.4, FVV #3 32.6

Lemon: 4 categories in top 10
FVV: 6 categories in top 10

Can you have a debate or conversation without being immature and hateful? I'm still waiting on the answer of why you like Lemon specifically on stats over FVV

I will ask you, why would you choose FVV over Lemon and you had not seen either play and you know nothing about them but the stats provided? FVV, in the stats provided, beat him bad in one category A/TO. You must think A/TO is more important then PPG. I think the other way around. Especially since he is only averaging 1.5 more assist then Lemon.

[shocktheheart]

Here would be my reason without watching any of them playing and seeing only the stats provided.

One is averaging 17 and one is not.
One only averages 1.4 assist more then the other.
The steals are even.
3Pt FG%--Again, without seeing either play and I am only going by stats...one has a higher %. I would conclude he has a higher % because he doesn't shoot as much because he doesn't average as much.
A/TO one person is clearly ahead
Minutes played-toss up.

So with all that is given. And I hadn't seen either play or no nothing about them. I would take Lemon.

Thanks for finally responding...don't agree with you. What about FT% or is that not very important to you? I would assume it would be since you want the scoring. So if he shoots two more 3pt attempts per game, FVV would average about the same amount as Lemon.

[shocktheheart]

See this? Here is the quote.


Lets take a look at Walt Lemon vs. Fred Van Vleet and you tell me who you want. (Using stats from Valley site which only posts top 10)

Scoring: #4. Lemon 17.1, FVV not in top 15
Assists: #1. FVV 5.4, Lemon #5 3.9
FT%: #7 FVV .829
Steals: #3 Lemon 2.1, FVV #4 1.8
3PT%: #4 FVV .429, Lemon not in top 10
A/TO: #1 FVV 4.6, Lemon not in top 10
Minutes Played: #2 Lemon 33.4, FVV #3 32.6

Lemon: 4 categories in top 10
FVV: 6 categories in top 10

Can you have a debate or conversation without being immature and hateful? I'm still waiting on the answer of why you like Lemon specifically on stats over FVV

I will ask you, why would you choose FVV over Lemon and you had not seen either play and you know nothing about them but the stats provided? FVV, in the stats provided, beat him bad in one category A/TO. You must think A/TO is more important then PPG. I think the other way around. Especially since he is only averaging 1.5 more assist then Lemon.

Since it is my PG, I want one that doesn't give up the ball and during the final minutes. You can trust with the ball in his hand and will knock down his FT's.

[Player13]

I left no stat off. The stats came from a Wichita fan. Can you not understand this????

You truly are unbelievable.

Somebody is unbelievable. Everybody knows why you're arguing this stupid point alright. You need to seek some kind of help.

[wsushox1]

Aces1982 I appreciate you trying to use stats in this argument. However, when 95% of posters on Bradley forums say they can not wait for the day that Lemon Jr. is gone from the program that is a pretty damning indictment against your argument.